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Author Topic: Panny GH3 - Still No Reviews  (Read 3887 times)
lowep
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« Reply #20 on: January 22, 2013, 06:09:35 AM »
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night fishing, Ili river, Kazakhstan... taken with my 5D

apologies for intruding into this GH3 thread with a question about this Canon 5D image  Undecided

this was made without flash, right? would you mind sharing which lens, ss and f-stop? if you can get such night shots with a 5D why (apart from bells and whistles and dust bunnies and video) why should I bother spending more on any later model Canon DSLR if IQ is of paramount concern and 12mp is good enough? 
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Ben Rubinstein
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« Reply #21 on: January 22, 2013, 11:07:09 AM »
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night fishing, Ili river, Kazakhstan... taken with my 5D

apologies for intruding into this GH3 thread with a question about this Canon 5D image  Undecided

this was made without flash, right? would you mind sharing which lens, ss and f-stop? if you can get such night shots with a 5D why (apart from bells and whistles and dust bunnies and video) why should I bother spending more on any later model Canon DSLR if IQ is of paramount concern and 12mp is good enough?  

Here is another showing just how good the 5Dc still is, sorry it's only a kid picture. iso 3200 f1.4, 1/13 handheld. That's under EV 0. Used auto focus.


Honestly, it's still an utterly incredible camera. Only just bought a 5D3 yesterday because my 2nd 5Dc died from overuse and old age.
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scooby70
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« Reply #22 on: January 22, 2013, 11:09:41 AM »
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night fishing, Ili river, Kazakhstan... taken with my 5D

...this was made without flash, right? would you mind sharing which lens, ss and f-stop?

I'm sorry for posting a 5D image in this thread. The reason I did so was that this is exactly the sort of shot and circumstance I'd love to use a compact system camera for but at the moment I have two issues with my admittedly ageing G1.

Firstly the very highest ISO performance is relatively poor, although this is probably fixed with the very latest cameras.

Secondly the light output from the EVF at wide apertures is uncomfortable for me. With my 25mm f0.95 and 55mm f1.7 I really can't use them wide open in very low light. At f2.8 it's much more useable but obviously I'm using a smaller aperture and therefore a higher ISO and/or shutter speed.

Still, not sooooo long ago I thought myself lucky to have an f4 lens.

The night fishing shot was taken with a 5D MK1, ISO 3200, 1/30 sec., Sigma 50mm f1.4 set at f1.4.
« Last Edit: January 22, 2013, 11:12:23 AM by scooby70 » Logged
fike
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« Reply #23 on: January 22, 2013, 12:54:08 PM »
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I like to read DPREview because it has a pretty comprehensive accounting of features and their database of raw images that can be compared side-by-side is quite large. I would never suggest that DPReview is the final authority on good cameras. I don't think they are.  But I would say they are a credible resource when comparing cameras.  I feel much the same about DXOMark. 

As for reviews on the Panasonic...as a recent adopter of MFT with the OM-D it seems like the press can't quite consider smaller cameras as serious tools for photo work, though the OM-D is the best treated of the bunch.  I see mirrorless (MFT or APS-C) eventually overtaking and replacing APS-C in the traditional DSLR size and shape.  Some in the press are seeing that trend, but there is a lot of inertia around the old way of selling DSLRs and review sites mirror that inertia.

After that long off-topic rant...good luck with the GH3. I am sure you will like it.
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Fike, Trailpixie, or Marc Shaffer
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lowep
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« Reply #24 on: January 22, 2013, 01:19:38 PM »
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5D MK1, ISO 3200, 1/30 sec., Sigma 50mm f1.4 set at f1.4

thanks, seeing is believing! Not sure if the GH3 or any other micro four thirds or APS=C camera can match this IQ?
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scooby70
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« Reply #25 on: January 22, 2013, 03:17:41 PM »
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5D MK1, ISO 3200, 1/30 sec., Sigma 50mm f1.4 set at f1.4

thanks, seeing is believing! Not sure if the GH3 or any other micro four thirds or APS=C camera can match this IQ?

I may be wrong but I think that the very latest CSC probably could match the 5D at ISO 3200, at least in reasonably sized prints when viewed normally.

I've only had two MFT so far, a GF1 and a G1 and the image quality between the two is pretty much identical IMVHO. I use/d both on auto ISO which selects anything from 100-1600, 2000, 2500 and 3200 being available to select manually. I'd say that up to about ISO 800 is no problem at all with reasonably sized prints easily lost and indistinguishable in a pile of 5D shots. I'd also say that 1000-1600 are usable with just a little care and that even the values above 1600 are useable with just a little more care especially as these cameras (IMVHO) tend to over expose at least at the higher ISO's and once the exposure is backed off to look a little more like the actual scene things look even better.

I took this shot with a GF1, ISO 1600, 1/80, f1.7 and it's perfectly usable as is every other shot I took that evening.



If ISO 1600 is acceptable with first generation MFT cameras I'd expect the latest ones to do better. I'd certainly like to try one but the only thing that's stopping me from ordering one at the moment is the issue that I personally have with the light output. I appreciate that for some it may be a non issue but I personally find shooting at wide apertures in low light very uncomfortable.
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k bennett
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« Reply #26 on: January 22, 2013, 08:34:55 PM »
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I have a GF1 and a GH2, and my wife has a G1. IIRC the GF1 and G1 have the same sensor. They are good up to ISO 800 with a little post processing, then ISO 1600 is usable. ISO 3200 is not so good, in my experience. Really not usable.

The GH2 has a very usable 3200, and I've shot some decent photos at 6400. Getting a proper exposure helps a lot - my GH2 tends to underexpose by about 2/3 of a stop, and increasing the exposure in Lightroom also increases the noise.

Of course, my expectations for image quality may be much lower than others'.
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scooby70
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« Reply #27 on: January 23, 2013, 05:52:47 AM »
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...GF1 and G1... ISO 3200 is not so good, in my experience. Really not usable.

Of course, my expectations for image quality may be much lower than others'.

Thinking about the performance I get from my own CSC v 5D and my own particular problems of higher ISO performance and actually using the cameras in low light I've convinced myself that from what I've seen on line the newer CSC's will provide good enough image quality for me to produce prints up to A3 at all ISO's up to and including 3200 and probably higher too with care.

I thought I'd check again the performance of my G1 at ISO 3200 but as I take very few shots at this setting I turned the light off and took the following test shot, ISO 3200, 1/2 sec. At the settings the camera chose it looked too bright to me and was also noisy. The exposure needed to be adjusted -1 and the darks and shadows set to -50 to produce a shot that still looked a little brighter than it looked to my eyes and more detail is still visible than I could actually see by eye, there is some blur because I couldn't hold the camera steady at this shutter speed. This is what I got...



Here's the NR screen in CS5 showing ho-hum hardly heroic or extreme settings, in fact the NR could probably be pushed higher for a cleaner final image...



If I can get this from an elderly G1 with little effort I think that I'll be perfectly happy with the image quality of any of the newer CSC's at higher ISO's and the lenses look good to me too. So the only questions I now face are can I live with fly by wire no marking lenses (although I mostly use legacy lenses I do like to have a couple of newer AF lenses too) and can I feel comfortable using an EVF in low light.

If I can find a newer CSC I feel comfortable to use in low light I think I would take it night fishing in Kazakhstan  Grin and not have any worries about actual image quality but perhaps my expectations are lower than others  Grin
 
I'm sorry for taking this thread more than a little off track but hopefully no one minded...
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k bennett
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« Reply #28 on: January 23, 2013, 07:24:52 AM »
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and not have any worries about actual image quality but perhaps my expectations are lower than others  Grin


Heh. I put that disclaimer in my post because it seems that every time I like a photo that I shot with Camera X at some ridiculously high ISO value, and it makes what I think is a nice print, I'll see a dozen posts here and elsewhere decrying Camera X for being totally unusable at ISO 400. And here I thought my print looked fairly nice, but I guess not.... Smiley

Anyway, getting back to your comment on newer compact cameras, yes, I think if you pick up an OM-D or a GH3 you will be quite happy with the results. My GH2 has somehow managed to make some very nice images in spite of my low standards. Smiley
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scooby70
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« Reply #29 on: January 23, 2013, 07:43:53 AM »
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I thought I had the lowest standards on the internet  Grin but I see that there are others who are easy to please Cheesy
« Last Edit: January 23, 2013, 07:45:31 AM by scooby70 » Logged
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