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Author Topic: Roll Paper Economy  (Read 2387 times)
Mike Guilbault
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« on: February 01, 2013, 09:48:40 PM »
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First of all, my 'large' 17" rolls of paper from my 4900 now look absolutely miniscule in the 9900!

So, I'm now wondering, with all the roll paper options available for the 44" printer, is there a roll paper size that works best?  10" of course for production runs of 8x10, but then is there an ideal size, 17", 24", 36", 44"?  I can of course see the 44" if you are a high volume printer and constantly have enough jobs to gang different sizes together for a print run, but if you don't have the volume... ?
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davidh202
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« Reply #1 on: February 01, 2013, 10:20:17 PM »
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I was buying  and stocking papers when Epson was running good sales last year (3 for the price of 2) etc.
I have a stock of single rolls of 44, 36, and more rolls of 24" canvas.  I never know when a cilient (or myself) will need larger wraps.  I have also stocked up on multiple rolls of 17" and 24" Ex Fiber,Hot and Cold Press, Bright and Natural, since these are the papers I use the most. It's hard to say which size is best.
With Epsons deals at Atlex's discount prices I essentially got 50% off on just about all the papers.
Epson has not been running the sales lately so I'm glad I invested in them when I did.

David  
« Last Edit: February 01, 2013, 10:22:20 PM by davidh202 » Logged
davidh202
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« Reply #2 on: February 01, 2013, 10:35:35 PM »
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I forgot to mention I do all my processing in ACR and Photoshop, but exclusively print with Qimage Ult, and it cannot be beat for the price, and convenience of printer setups and paper "economy"!
If your not already familiar with it, go to the site and download the trial.

http://www.ddisoftware.com/qimage-u/
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neile
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« Reply #3 on: February 01, 2013, 10:51:48 PM »
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The first law of inkjet printing: the roll size you didn't buy is the roll size you realize you need when starting your next print job.
The second law of inkjet printing: the rolls you stock up on are the ones that sit gathering dust.

At least, in my experience Sad

Neil
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Neil Enns
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nairb
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« Reply #4 on: February 01, 2013, 10:55:10 PM »
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Is there a good Canadian wholesaler for paper anyone can recommend? Until now I've been just going retail, but as I look to move to a 44" printer myself, I'd like to find better prices if possible as ill also be upping my volume.


Edit- Amplis, that's one I've heard of. Does anyone know what their prices are like?
« Last Edit: February 01, 2013, 11:23:13 PM by nairb » Logged
bill t.
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« Reply #5 on: February 01, 2013, 11:35:37 PM »
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Since I print for myself only, I tend to adopt standard sizes that fit well on 44" rolls.  So I print a lot of images 43" wide.  Quite often I have 2, 21 x 60's top and bottom, plus a single 30 x 43 printed together on a single 44" x 8 foot length.  I tape up the printed sheet to a 51 x 97 inch sheet of Coroplast for coating, then mount the whole thing on Gator, then cut it up.  Sometimes if the images don't mesh efficiently on a single sheet, I slip in test strips from images I'm working on or just small prints to use the media.  It's economies of handling like that where the big printers can really shine.  You can save a lot of time in logistics.  I do all the layout strip up myself in Photoshop, but as mentioned I believe Qimage has a good layout tool that even allows you to apply different profiles to various images on the same printing job.
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aaronchan
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« Reply #6 on: February 02, 2013, 02:08:18 AM »
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I stock both 44" and 24". Mostly 1 of each sizes of each types of paper.
Plus, I use Qimage as well.
But of course you can use some other software if you use a Mac such as Imagenest or Overdrive.

aaron
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jferrari
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« Reply #7 on: February 02, 2013, 06:40:25 AM »
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Not wanting to hijack the thread but just wondering what the advantage might be to use QImage for printing instead of LR? Thanks.     - Jim
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Mike Guilbault
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« Reply #8 on: February 02, 2013, 06:42:06 AM »
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The first law of inkjet printing: the roll size you didn't buy is the roll size you realize you need when starting your next print job.
The second law of inkjet printing: the rolls you stock up on are the ones that sit gathering dust.

At least, in my experience Sad

Neil

That's what I was afraid of Neil. Like trying to choose which lenses you want to bring on an outing!

I usually print directly from LR and quite happy with the layout tools available in the print module, but I'll take a look at Imagenest and Overdrive (I'm on a Mac and believe that Qimage is PC only).

Unfortunately we don't seem to have any large resellers of paper in Canada.  Amplis is a distributor for many lines, but as far as I know sells the paper at retail to individuals.  Vistek is the largest retail seller, probably followed by Henry's, at least here in Ontario.  I'm able to get my Epson paper, at least most of it, across the street at a small computer store and he gets it in at 'fair' retail pricing but at least I don't have to pay for shipping.

I'm not too worried about the pricing of the paper rolls, but just want to be efficient with my purchases (as Neil eludes to above) and minimize waste.  

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jsiva
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« Reply #9 on: February 02, 2013, 07:52:38 AM »
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Is there a good Canadian wholesaler for paper anyone can recommend? Until now I've been just going retail, but as I look to move to a 44" printer myself, I'd like to find better prices if possible as ill also be upping my volume.


Edit- Amplis, that's one I've heard of. Does anyone know what their prices are like?

For Breathing Color, Aplis, speak with Phil.  The are about the same price as BC direct, without the silly shipping fees.  They are a distributor and handle a number of manufacturers.

I have also recently started dealing with FinestraArt.com.  $9 flat shipping, and their prices are the best I have seen US/Canada for comparable paper or canvas.  Need to use a little more to see how their products compare.

Canson - Vistek has sales on an off.

Hahnemuhle - B&H is still the cheapest.
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neile
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« Reply #10 on: February 02, 2013, 09:39:25 AM »
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I will say that in my case the 17" rolls (even with the big printer) get used the most. Nearly all of my clients want prints 17x22" or smaller, so the 17" roll is perfect. I do stock a couple of 24" rolls for when clients go crazy and want something bigger.

For larger sizes I have a 36" roll of Canon satin photographic paper, since at that size most people I print for are cost-concious and care less about selling the work as "fine art". Usually at that size people are just after a cheap poster.

Neil
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Neil Enns
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kdphotography
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« Reply #11 on: February 02, 2013, 10:05:16 AM »
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I generally stock mostly 24", 36" and 44" rolls.  A few 17" rolls, but those are mostly for use on a K7 B&W Piezography printer.

I think the most economical approach is to only buy a handful (or less) of media that you really like or suits your clients needs.  Profile those papers well and really get to know how your printer handles them and how best to make images sing with those papers.  The quickest way to an empty wallet is buying every paper that comes out and having it sit on the shelves....

I like Qimage Ultimate for variety of reasons.  Yes, it does nest images efficiently across the roll of media, and you can select images and crop on the fly.  Probably the most unsung advantage that I like is Qimage automatically remembers the different printer settings for each type of paper/media and icc profile!  In other words, when I select a different paper and icc profile, Qimage automatically selects the printer settings that I last used/checked when I print with this icc profile and paper.  This helps to reduce user error and bad prints---saving money!  Qimage also addresses what I call the George Constanza Shrinkage Effect when printing on canvas (Seinfeld--"it was the pool!").  Shrinkage can occur after coating canvas. Qimage lets you dial in a percentage to compensate for shrinkage (lengthwise).  There are many other great tools that I may not use often, but having Qimage remember printer settings is my favorite.  It makes printing easy.

ken
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hugowolf
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« Reply #12 on: February 02, 2013, 11:59:00 AM »
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I stock mostly 24 and 36 inch rolls. I only have 44 inch rolls of canvas (a lot is lost in the wrap), Epson lustre, and matte poster paper.

If you have the space to store it, the keep a look out for 24 x 36 inch sheets. No decurling: it starts flat and stays flat. Atlex recently had BFK Rives in this sheet size priced much lower than 24 inch rolls. Hahnemühle Photo Rag 308 and German Etching 310 are both 50% cheaper compared to 24 inch rolls.

Brian A
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Mike Guilbault
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« Reply #13 on: February 02, 2013, 04:19:56 PM »
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About the largest I'd want to print on paper is 24x36, so that's a good idea Brian. After that a roll of 44 " canvas should handle the big stuff.
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Garnick
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« Reply #14 on: February 03, 2013, 11:24:19 AM »
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Hi Mike,

I guess I'd have to agree with Neil and his assessment of the roll paper situation.  That's why I usually stock 10, 16, 20, 24, 36 and 44" Luster Paper, and of course various sheet sizes as well.  Not all of those sizes for other papers, but I do a lot of printing on Photo Papers for my customers, as opposed to Fine Art Papers.  The Fine Art and Canvas sizes are somewhat more restricted.  Having a small dealer account I deal with Daymen and get the dealer net, and I buy my Breathing Color Canvas and Iflord Galerie papers from Amplis.  Other than Vistek I've never found a distributor in the GTA for Eco Print Shield coatings, so of course I buy from them.  For me, convenience is the most important issue to be considered.  Time is money and there usually isn't enough of either, and without a 50" D-Roller, ganging prints would be a bit of an issue in my case.  However, if you are ever looking for a good layout app for ganging images, the QTR Print Tool is the answer in my opinion.  If you are familiar with the QuadTone RIP and its master Roy Harrington you'll certainly know that this little app will do a wonderful job and everything you could want in a layout program.  And for $39USD it can't be beat as far as I'm concerned. 

Good luck with the 9900 Mike, I'm sure you'll enjoy.  One thing I would strongly advise is to get the extended warranty.  For the first year and a half my warranty cover the cost of approximately a printer an a half.  The third and final warranty period expires in April, but that past year has so far been virtually problem free.  It's certainly not inexpensive, but neither is a head replacement, two cleaning stations and and new ink bay.  The warranty is a good insurance policy and fortunately I learned that lesson within the first year, which convince me to extend the Epson warranty for as long as possible.  After April I'm on my own, but now I know more about the machine and part replacements which will go a long way toward maintaining it for a longer life expectancy.  Take care of the 9900 and it will take care of you.

Here's the URL for the QTR Print Tool if you are interested:  http://www.quadtonerip.com/html/QTRprinttool.html

Gary       
   
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Idololab
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« Reply #15 on: February 04, 2013, 03:27:31 PM »
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The first law of inkjet printing: the roll size you didn't buy is the roll size you realize you need when starting your next print job.
The second law of inkjet printing: the rolls you stock up on are the ones that sit gathering dust.

At least, in my experience Sad

Neil
Bingo!
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George Marinos
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framah
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« Reply #16 on: February 04, 2013, 03:55:11 PM »
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The first law of inkjet printing: the roll size you didn't buy is the roll size you realize you need when starting your next print job.
The second law of inkjet printing: the rolls you stock up on are the ones that sit gathering dust.

At least, in my experience Sad

Neil

A corollary to that is that as soon as you have ordered the rolls of 17" paper .. the customer calls and is all exited and has decided that he wants everything printed at 20x24!! Shocked
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framah
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« Reply #17 on: February 04, 2013, 03:59:41 PM »
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Had a customer in 2 months ago who took one look at my 11880 and said: "How large can you print?"
I said it will take 64" paper and she got all excited and said that's what she wants!!

So i had to go and order a roll of 64" paper. Luckily, the job more than paid for the paper and my friends time helping me load and unload the machine!! 
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TSJ1927
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« Reply #18 on: February 04, 2013, 05:30:49 PM »
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From time to time, I'll buy a roll of FA Paper or canvas in 60" rolls  (have an 11880) and cut it in half to get two 30" ones (minus the saw kerf =.10 inch).  This satisifies the size for clients that need the odd size 22x22 or 21x26 canvas with extra 2" borders and not having to use a 36" standard roll.  I use a thin 12in 80 tooth carbide tipped blade
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Wayne Fox
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« Reply #19 on: February 04, 2013, 11:32:53 PM »
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Had a customer in 2 months ago who took one look at my 11880 and said: "How large can you print?"
I said it will take 64" paper and she got all excited and said that's what she wants!!

So i had to go and order a roll of 64" paper. Luckily, the job more than paid for the paper and my friends time helping me load and unload the machine!! 


Smiley  cool!
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