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Author Topic: Leica M9 ISO 1,000 and above NR settings  (Read 2100 times)
IWC Doppel
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« on: February 11, 2013, 04:31:10 AM »
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Hi,

I have been experimenting with NR in Lightroom on my M9 RAW images, I have all the LuLa videos and read a lot on this somewhat complex subject. I have left NR until now even though I have been using LR since LR3 and shoot a lot in low light. I previously had an aversion to the plasticity seen with a lot of pictures with NR.

Can anyone share some subtle home settings for the M9 that keep all (well nearly all) the detail but reduce the noise a little. The DNG's of the new M in respct of ISO performance are making me a little jealous !

If I can acheive an extra stop or 1/2 stop with little or no compromise I will be a happy chap  Wink

Tks
IWC
« Last Edit: February 11, 2013, 04:33:01 AM by IWC Doppel » Logged
JeanMichel
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« Reply #1 on: February 11, 2013, 03:24:13 PM »
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Hi,
I rarely go over ISO 640 (which is a full stop faster than my film days setting of ISO 320 for T-Max or Tri-X!). The noise reduction is really an image by image situation; key is to not underexpose to begin with. For my high ISO images ( over ISO 1250)  I go to about +20 in NR, and perhaps +5 or +7 in grain. I also find that I have to often modify the camera calibration by adjusting the red primary by up to  +20 and decreasing the saturation by -5 to -10. It all varies from image to image.
Jean-Michel
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Jim Kasson
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« Reply #2 on: February 13, 2013, 06:50:42 PM »
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I'm been doing some testing that indicates that increasing the ISO setting on the M9 beyond 640 not only does not provide lower noise than just cranking up the "Exposure" slider in Lightroom, it actually creates slightly higher noise.

It's early days on this for me, but you can see the M9 stuff here.

I'll do some image testing similar to what I did for the D800E in the two posts before the one pointed to by the link above if there's any interest.

Jim
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AlfSollund
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« Reply #3 on: February 15, 2013, 06:13:13 AM »
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Hi,

I take quite a few photos during Arctic winter when the sun is away, so I have to use high ISO, up to 1250, but I prefer to stay at 640 with M9. The important is to ETTR. I use LR4.x and normally apply some Lum and Col noise reduction (<20). I turn off Detail and Sharpening, but increas Contrast (in reduction). In my limited understanding this leads to an evil spiral. Increase in sharpening leads to more noise leading to...How much noise reduction to use depends on print or WEB export. As a rule of thumb I turn up reduction until satisfied in LR, and then reduce it a bit before exporting, and even more for prints. 

Dont know if this helps, please also help me with additional / correcting info :-)
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- If your're not telling a story with photo you're only adding noise -
http://alfsollund.com/
IWC Doppel
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« Reply #4 on: February 15, 2013, 06:47:30 AM »
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Thanks interesting read regarding noise and ISO above 640.

Regarding turning off detail and sharpening, can you say which detail you are referring to ?

I have three detail sliders , one in sharpening and two in NR

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JeanMichel
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« Reply #5 on: February 15, 2013, 01:47:34 PM »
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Thanks interesting read regarding noise and ISO above 640.

Regarding turning off detail and sharpening, can you say which detail you are referring to ?

I have three detail sliders , one in sharpening and two in NR



Hi,
Once again, at the risk of sounding like a salesperson for the L-L tutorials, I suggest that you purchase the Lightroom tutorial from this site. It is an excellent way of quickly learning much about LR.
Jean-Michel
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IWC Doppel
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« Reply #6 on: February 15, 2013, 03:28:27 PM »
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I have them  Wink
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AlfSollund
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« Reply #7 on: February 16, 2013, 10:24:00 AM »
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Thanks interesting read regarding noise and ISO above 640.

Regarding turning off detail and sharpening, can you say which detail you are referring to ?

I have three detail sliders , one in sharpening and two in NR


I normally turn off Sharpening - Amount regardless of other settings. So in this position it doesn matter how Sharpening - Detail is set. Imo the M9 files seldom needs sharpening except for export where I use the Standard setting. (I have used some compact, m43 ad APS-C. For these i used sharpening). The other 2 sharpenings are Detail and Detail in Noise Reduction. These settings only matter when you turn up Luminance and Color. I normally have these set to 0 also.  Please dont take my word only, just try yourself  Wink.
« Last Edit: February 16, 2013, 10:27:22 AM by AlfSollund » Logged

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- If your're not telling a story with photo you're only adding noise -
http://alfsollund.com/
Jim Kasson
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« Reply #8 on: February 20, 2013, 07:31:32 PM »
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I've finished the testing that relates to how high to set the ISO on the M9. From fifty thousand feet, my conclusion is that, if you're using the DNG (raw) format, you shouldn't go over 640 unless there are special circumstances that require you to do so. Above that setting, you get more image noise than if you just cranked up the Exposure slider in Lightroom instead of increasing the ISO setting on the camera. Up to 640, you'll get slightly better signal-to-noise ratios in the lighter tones and no worse SNR in the darker tones if (if you need to boost the sensitivity over the native ISO 160) you do it in the camera rather than in post.

Here's a relevant plot:



Here's a link to the test results: http://blog.kasson.com/?p=2824

There's not a highly detailed explanation of the test methods in that post, although I do hit the high spots. I'll be testing the Sony RX-1 and NEX-7 in the next few days, then I'll be working on a summary of the whole "When do I increase the ISO setting on my camera and when do I make similar changes in Lightroom or ACR?" question.

Jim

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IWC Doppel
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« Reply #9 on: February 21, 2013, 12:38:46 AM »
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Jim, hi

Very interesting, I am not sure if you have seen this, published from Leica. This is why previously I chose ISO speeds of 160,320,500,1000,1600. The green is the MM, the blue the M9

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