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Author Topic: HowTo? Get PM5's MeasureTool to "Save" TestCharts (button never enables)?  (Read 4337 times)
l_d_allan
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« on: February 24, 2013, 08:38:39 AM »
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Note: continuation of thread that started in printer+paper+ink sub-forum
http://www.luminous-landscape.com/forum/index.php?topic=75482.0

I fired up Measure Tool and without my dongle attached, I can not save out a chart in the TestChart Generator utility. If I plug in my dongle, then I can save out a target.

Thanks. That would strongly suggest that the purple dongle that came with my eBay purchase of PMP5 plus n.i.b. iSis is inadequate to "Save" test-charts generated by MT.
Bummer.

Quote
What's not clear is what you are trying to do...apparently you can print out the TC918 target and make a profile in PM, correct? That implies that your dongle is working, at least for ProfileMaker, correct?

Well, mostly correct (and great question). The profiles generated by PM are coming out semi-randomly flawed, so I'm obviously doing something wrong:
  • print TC918 with ACPU with Canon 9000-2 print driver set to "Manual + None" to turn off color management
  • (please look at attached and advise if I'm doing something wrong)
  • measure test chart print with PM + iSis
  • generate profile with PM
  • note: different problems using CS4 with "No Color Management" to make TC918 print

There are several issue related to "semi-randomly flawed" that could make this post tl:dr.

My interest in MeasureTool's TestChartGenerator was to make simpler test-charts with fewer and bigger patches.


 
« Last Edit: February 24, 2013, 08:50:22 AM by l_d_allan » Logged

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« Reply #1 on: February 24, 2013, 11:38:45 AM »
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Note: continuation of thread that started in printer+paper+ink sub-forum
http://www.luminous-landscape.com/forum/index.php?topic=75482.0

Thanks. That would strongly suggest that the purple dongle that came with my eBay purchase of PMP5 plus n.i.b. iSis is inadequate to "Save" test-charts generated by MT.
Bummer.

So the dongle will not allow any of the usual features to unlock? Either it's 'broken' or you got screwed as that's key in making the software (which anyone can download from X-rite) work outside of demo mode. In Demo mode, you can basically measure with various Spectrophotometer's but not much more. Even the iSis should allow more functionality I thought. Something is off, is the Dongle lit up? Maybe the dongle tools are necessary to have it be detected???
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Andrew Rodney
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« Reply #2 on: February 24, 2013, 11:57:14 AM »
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Either it's 'broken' or you got screwed as that's key in making the software (which anyone can download from X-rite) work outside of demo mode.
I've already answered this in the earlier part of the thread at http://www.luminous-landscape.com/forum/index.php?topic=75482.0
"Not every purple dongle has the necessary licence to use the chart generator feature in the measure tool. It all depends on what original package you bought.
My dongle doesn't allow chart generation, measurement averaging,  scanner profiling or device link profiles, but everything else in the PM5 suite works fine."

So the dongle is probably working perfectly, but it's licensed for one of the more cut down versions of PMP5 like Photostudio Pro.
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digitaldog
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« Reply #3 on: February 24, 2013, 12:11:26 PM »
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I've already answered this in the earlier part of the thread at http://www.luminous-landscape.com/forum/index.php?topic=75482.0
"Not every purple dongle has the necessary licence to use the chart generator feature in the measure tool. It all depends on what original package you bought.

News to me, every PMP dongle that was mated to the proper version worked to build charts and unlock those kinds of functionality. NOW, there were older dongles such as ones for PMP 3 or versions that didn't have chart generation etc. I have a few such older dongles. Plug them in, try to run a newer version and they didn't work as expected. How could GMB update their software without a provision to update the dongles? Or how could someone with a more limited version of PMP pay to unlock say CMYK or Multiprofile or Device Link functionality? You had to pay GMB an upgrade fee, you got a code that would update or unlock that functionality. It sounds like someone get sold an older dongle to me. Or that person assumes the version of the dongle and software are on parity. IF I sell you on eBay a dongle for PMP 4, it isn't going to run PMP 5.
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Andrew Rodney
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l_d_allan
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« Reply #4 on: February 24, 2013, 12:23:27 PM »
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The dongle definitely lights up. As part of the installation, there was something like HASP installed, which I surmise is related to dongle activation and permissions. I recall Windows update installing an update to this HASP utility.

The n.i.b. software that contained the purple dongle reads "ProfileMaker Pro 5 ... Photostudio". There is a check in the checkbox for PM5 Measure Tool. When I launch MT without the dongle, I get the message "some features in demo mode". When I plug in the dongle, it lights up. Then when I launch MT, I don't get the message about "some features in demo mode".

I'm almost certain I recall the first X-Rite support tech mentioning something very close to ... "I can unplug my dongle and the Save button is still enabled."

Wow, this clears up some misconceptions on my part. I apparently assumed ... falsely it appears ... that a check in the PM5 MeasureTool checkbox meant I'd be able to save profiles. Sigh ... I'm glad that support tech didn't have a bridge in NYC he wanted to sell to me :-)

The support tech did annotate our phone conversation with a comment about:
Code:
Case Description 00061940: Lynn is trying to create a profile with MeasureTool, but isn't able to save his targets.

He's using a very non-standard workflow, so I've asked him to send us both his resulting profiles and the target TIFF files for review  

(done ... didn't hear back from x-rite so called again

BTW, the above may or may not explain the "semi-random flawed profiles" I've been getting, but that can hold for another thread.
« Last Edit: February 24, 2013, 12:37:30 PM by l_d_allan » Logged

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« Reply #5 on: February 24, 2013, 12:35:43 PM »
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News to me,
I surprised you haven't been aware of that.
I've read a lot of complaints about the baffling way GMB, and more recently X-Rite, have sold their products via a bewildering array of options all with very similar sounding titles.

I bought into PMP5 back in 2005 and, if I recall correctly, there were about 8 different packages, all called Profile Maker Pro 5, all with different titles Photostudio, Photostudio Pro etc. all with subtly different options. You could then upgrade the dongle to allow extra functionality eg scanner profiling, full use of the measure tool, each upgrade was about £400 in the UK.

So it's most likely our OP has just bought a package without the necessary licence.

Rather than discuss the craziness of GMB/XRIte's marketing strategy, it would be useful to find out what problems he's seeing and if something like Colorport will help ?
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« Reply #6 on: February 24, 2013, 12:39:06 PM »
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I surprised you haven't been aware of that.

Unaware that the proper dongle for a proper version of PMP works? That a possibly older version of a dongle will not?

I have a PMP dongle (old and new). The one built (updated) for PMP 4 does provide all the functionality it should. The older one doesn't.

Quote
I bought into PMP5 back in 2005 and, if I recall correctly, there were about 8 different packages, all called Profile Maker Pro 5, all with different titles Photostudio, Photostudio Pro etc. all with subtly different options. You could then upgrade the dongle to allow extra functionality eg scanner profiling, full use of the measure tool, each upgrade was about £400 in the UK.

ALL (V4) dongles should allow you to build targets.

Quote
So it's most likely our OP has just bought a package without the necessary licence.

Yes, one that is a license for an older version that was never built for the creation of targets I suspect.
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Andrew Rodney
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« Reply #7 on: February 24, 2013, 12:44:55 PM »
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ALL (V4) dongles should allow you to build targets.
Sorry, but you're wrong here.
Firstly we're talking about PMP 5.
As I've said three times now, on PMP5 different versions of PMP5 have different functions enabled on the dongle.
The OP has said he's got the Photostudio version, that didn't allow the full functions of the measure tool to work.
See the FAQ at http://www.xrite.com/product_overview.aspx?ID=1225&Action=support&SupportID=3647
« Last Edit: February 24, 2013, 12:50:51 PM by Rhossydd » Logged
digitaldog
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« Reply #8 on: February 24, 2013, 12:54:09 PM »
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Sorry, but you're wrong here.
Firstly we're talking about PMP 5.

My bad, yes I meant to say V5. All V5 versions with the proper dongle should be able to save a target. But a V3 dongle wouldn’t as that older version didn't have the same functionality as the V5 target generator.

That's one possibility. The other is the dongle or dongle coding is screwed up. The dongles have the ability to be updated using the dongle tool and GMB supplied codes, presumably that process could be messed up although again, with a PMP 5 dongle, even with it's lowest functionally (whatever odd name GMB gave to just RGB profiling), it should be able to build and save an RGB target.
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Andrew Rodney
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l_d_allan
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« Reply #9 on: February 24, 2013, 01:00:44 PM »
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Rather than discuss the craziness of GMB/XRIte's marketing strategy, it would be useful to find out what problems he's seeing

Amen, brothers.

Part of the reason for my ill-fated poll (in process of being removed) was to see if X-Rite appears to be getting better or worse since the acquistion. My experience has been less than hoped for. YMMV, obviously ... and not meaning to start a flame-war.

I did attempt to ACPU-print and measure the included TC918 target. Short version ... I didn't notice until later that the iSis alignment was off.

Gosh, were those profiles flawed   Embarrassed
Similar issues with ColorPort.   Huh
Different issues with i1Profiler's test-chart generator (seems to work pretty well without a dongle, but doesn't seem to play well with PMP5)   Cry

Quote
and if something like Colorport will help ?

I'm seriously thinking of tackling the learning curve of Colorport and then perhaps the command-line ArgyllCms ... also another thread.
« Last Edit: February 24, 2013, 01:08:08 PM by l_d_allan » Logged

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« Reply #10 on: February 24, 2013, 01:06:51 PM »
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ColorPort is free, can support the iSis. You can feed the measured data from CP to PMP or i1P etc. It too isn't without it's flaws. It can build targets although not with the same options or capabilities of MeasureTool. You'll need some kind of txt file with the target data you wish to feed to it to generate color patches and targets.
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Andrew Rodney
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« Reply #11 on: February 24, 2013, 01:22:44 PM »
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I'm thinking it might be helpful to start another thread ... like:
HowTo? Use iSis + ColorPort + PMP to generate printer profiles?

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The only reason I (Schewe) have a "Sr. Member" status is that 1) I'm old (just turned 59)

I'm even older ... older than dirt ... and a CM newbie.

I'll admit ... to my shame ... that the cumulative learning curves for recalcitrant MT, PMP, i1Profiler, ColorPort, etc. have been Excedrin headache #666  Roll Eyes
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« Reply #12 on: February 24, 2013, 01:37:32 PM »
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I'm thinking it might be helpful to start another thread ... like:
HowTo? Use iSis + ColorPort + PMP to generate printer profiles?

It can be pretty easy (or not).

Download and install CP
Use one of it's supported targets (TC918) for iSis
Print target (you can recreate a page size if you wish)
Measure within CP then save out CGATS formatted file
Load CGATS formatted file in ProfileMaker

If you want to import measurement or reference data that exists you could build a new target from that. You can add custom colors etc. NO barcode support for iSis.
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« Reply #13 on: February 24, 2013, 01:42:09 PM »
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The latest version I have of CP on Mac is 2.0.5. Be sure to load the Help for it and note the version <g>
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« Reply #14 on: February 24, 2013, 02:18:16 PM »
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Andrew, Rhossydd, et'al

Thanks! for your patient assistance on this "shooting myself in the foot" conundrum.

In hindsight, I may have given up on CP too soon. At first, I lost interest because it flat refused to measure the included TC918 with bar-code.

TMI?
Then I had trouble with the 6mm + 6mm spacing of PMP & i1Profiler compared to the 8mm + 6mm spacing of CP. I attempted to modify the complicated-to-me iSis_INFO tags in the .txt files for PMP to accept CP prints for measurement. I couldn't get that to work (misalignment or "cannot communicate with iSis" or deeply flawed profiles).

I also was unable to get CP to recognize 6mm + 6mm spacing from i1P generated test-charts, even after tweaking the deeply buried arguments in the CP .xml files for:
Thickness="8" Spacing="6"

Another source of whining ... the included TC918 files had trouble with "Use barcode to identify test chart", perhaps due to mis-matched filename and bar-code.


« Last Edit: February 24, 2013, 07:11:41 PM by l_d_allan » Logged

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« Reply #15 on: February 24, 2013, 04:10:44 PM »
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All V5 versions with the proper dongle should be able to save a target. an RGB target.
How many times does it need to be pointed out to you ? YOU ARE WRONG

Just read the reference on my last post to X-Rite's FAQ. Not all versions of PMP5 offer the same functionality, some variants of the PMP5 package won't save custom created targets.

Andrew, you're at risk of loosing credibility here.
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l_d_allan
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« Reply #16 on: February 24, 2013, 04:23:20 PM »
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Andrew, you're at risk of loosing credibility here.

Gentlemen ... perhaps in a separate thread? Or offline?
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« Reply #17 on: February 24, 2013, 07:09:34 PM »
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It can be pretty easy (or not).

This could be a case of "the devil is in the details".
Or "the second one is a whole lot easier than the first one". :-)

Quote

Download and install CP
Use one of it's supported targets (TC918) for iSis
Print target (you can recreate a page size if you wish)
Measure within CP then save out CGATS formatted file
Load CGATS formatted file in ProfileMaker

If you want to import measurement or reference data that exists you could build a new target from that. You can add custom colors etc. NO barcode support for iSis.

I'll give this a try after a good nights sleep. I recall CP having an included 729=9x9x9 target, but not a TC918. Again, Thanks!
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« Reply #18 on: February 26, 2013, 04:40:48 AM »
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Wow, this clears up some misconceptions on my part. I apparently assumed ... falsely it appears ... that a check in the PM5 MeasureTool checkbox meant I'd be able to save profiles.

I'm unable to use the MT Test-Chart-Generator to Save test-charts, apparently because the dongle included with my n.i.b. PMP5 doesn't have that permission / license.

I'd appreciate someone with MT that can Save test-charts to:
  • Import the attached 992-patch CGATS .txt file into MT
  • (it was created with i1Profiler 1.4.2 demo ... 32x31 6mm patches with BarCode)
  • Save the reference file as CGATS format that PMP5 can read (the Save button never enables for me, so I don't know what happens after that)
  • My speculation is that the generated 992Bc.txt file will include a valid iSis_INFO rather than me using trial-and-error to guess what the values should be
  • Reply to this post with the CGATS 992Bc.txt file as an attachment
  • I wouldn't think this would violate x-rite / gmb license conditions, but IANAL
  • I further speculate that MT would generate a 992Bc.tif image, but I don't think I'd need that (.tif generated by i1Profiler should work)
  • I'd attempt to use that 992Bc.txt file with my iSis and PMP5 or MT to actually scan the 992Bc.tif image.
  • Then use my enabled-for-printer-profiles PMP5 to generate a .icc printer profile.
  • Whew ... as the X-Rite support tech annotated on my case history: "very non-standard work-flow"
  • FWIW ... Andrew, I am also trying to get a ColorPort + PMP5 workflow to work, but encountered glitches. Haven't given up.
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« Reply #19 on: February 26, 2013, 08:52:58 AM »
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I did speak to a support tech at x-rite this morning regarding this issue. She suggested using the LicenseTool to get specifics on what the software does and doesn't do.

LT did detect the dongle, and provided a summary of capabilities. However, I was unable to figure out what it was looking for as the "License Key" (see attached). There was a bar-code on the outside of the NIB PMP5-PhotoStudio container ... 7-640###-##### ... but LT never accepted that number, or other variations of that number.

I wasn't able to find any other numbers in the box, or in the registration reply I got from x-rite.

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