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Author Topic: FedEx  (Read 5454 times)
Rob C
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« Reply #40 on: March 01, 2013, 03:39:34 AM »
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Russ I think you would best if you close down the thread now. The future of the forum is more important than Fedex. Sad


I agree. I also believe that if it is closed down, then the point of being here is lost.

It's not really anyone's fault if some writers can't see the same things as others: everyone is different even though there are certain common areas where some opinions meet.

In my own case, as you can see from many other threads, when I realise that a particular person simply doesn't understand my point of view (he doesn't have to agree with it), I just stop responding to him: there's no point in my getting angry or upset about matters photographic, especially when I fear my next heart attack is probably the final one.

Rob C
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amolitor
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« Reply #41 on: March 01, 2013, 08:44:41 AM »
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I didn't read every single post in detail, but I didn't notice anyone talking about the highway sign.

Genres be damned, this is a fine piece of work that strikes me as a capsule summary of America. We have the wild landscape with fantastic light, a landscape that while not uniquely American reads strongly as American. Then we have the highway, empty but for the truck, and the distinctively American highway sign.

As a pure image, the placement of things in it, it's nothing like a Walker Evans. As a statement of an idea it's very very very Walker Evans. I read it as "this is America, without judgement". The "without judgement" part might be the most important thing.
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RSL
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« Reply #42 on: March 01, 2013, 09:47:05 AM »
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Thanks everybody. Just to complete the picture here are a couple more. The one with the cars heading east is the first in the series. The one with the FedEx truck in the distance is the one after that. Then comes the one I first posted, and finally the one with the other side of the freeway in sight way on the left side of the picture. There are several others from this sequence in my files. I like to get my wife to drive when we're going through scenery like this so I can sit in the right seat and shoot. I'm not thrilled about the softness I get shooting through safety glass, but that's life in the fast lane.

As far as closing the thread is concerned, if it gets nasty I'll try to beat Chris to the punch.
« Last Edit: March 01, 2013, 10:36:24 AM by RSL » Logged

Chris Calohan
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« Reply #43 on: March 01, 2013, 09:52:52 AM »
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I can't wait until late March when I head back out west to pick up my newly purchased (used) motorhome and wend my way back through upper AZ, lower UT, and then across the top and bottom of NM and CO (the southwestern part of the USA). Taking all my camera gear, computer and gonna have some fun! No, if the local gendarmes didn't get so persnickity about pulling off to the side and setting up a tripod...oh well.
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Eric Myrvaagnes
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« Reply #44 on: March 01, 2013, 11:00:02 AM »
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How about the school that says that cloning out a major element of an image is one step too far in manipulation? Veracity tends to have a virtue of its own.
OH, SB! How can you?

We've had several tiresome and lengthy discussions already that seemed to me to establish that "veracity" is vital only in the fields of photojournalism or scientific photography, where creativity should never get in the way of truth. But in "creative" photography, pretty much anything goes (such as in Rhein II  Wink .)

As for shutting down the thread, it seems to me the disagreements in this thread have been pretty civil.

As for the Important Question of whether or not to keep the FedEx Logo on the truck.......
Well. I've been going back and forth, and I still haven't made up my mind.  Smiley
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rogerxnz
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« Reply #45 on: March 01, 2013, 11:27:33 AM »
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As for shutting down the thread, it seems to me the disagreements in this thread have been pretty civil.

I agree and I have not seen any personal attacks on anyone for their view.

I would be disappointed if the thread was hijacked into a discussion about "truth" in photography or whether it should be shut down.
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Slobodan Blagojevic
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« Reply #46 on: March 01, 2013, 12:14:09 PM »
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OH, SB! How can you?

We've had several tiresome and lengthy discussions already that seemed to me to establish that "veracity" is vital only in the fields of photojournalism or scientific photography, where creativity should never get in the way of truth. But in "creative" photography, pretty much anything goes (such as in Rhein II  Wink .)...

Eric,

What I wrote was in the context of removing or not the logo, and thus not much to do with those discussions. In that sense, veracity is the crucial element in defending the logo, the symbolism of which Rob already explained. Without the logo, it's just a truck and much of that symbolism is gone.

Also, my impression was that Russ was not trying to make a Fine Art piece or another Rhein II. If yes, then, of course, anything goes, and not only the logo but the whole truck can be replaced by, say, a flying saucer.

What I see instead is a genre-spanning photograph, mixing landscape, documentary, travel, and road-trip photography. The documentary part in it is the one that is more related to veracity.

Simply speaking, the image as-is speaks to me much more than any other manipulated variation of it, without the logo, road signs and/or truck itself or any combination of those. As I said, veracity tends to have a virtue of its own, and it does (for me) in this picture. I am not saying one can not or should not manipulate, I am not saying one can not or should not depart from documentary into creative. All I am saying is that, for this picture, sticking to what really was works and has a virtue of its own (again, the symbolism that Rob explained).
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William Walker
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« Reply #47 on: March 01, 2013, 01:09:53 PM »
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Russ

I have come back to your original post here numerous times.

I grew up in the country and always feel more relaxed out of the city. The FEDEX sign on the truck jars me for what it represents i.e. the city - so on that level the picture, "as is" must be working...The fact that it has raised so much debate indicates that it must be working.

What I do find refreshing in the series you posted is that, as a non-American, I am happy to see some "new" America landscape. A nice change from the "iconic" sights that one sees so often. There must be a million places Ansel Adams didn't get to, I'd love to see more of those...

William

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Slobodan Blagojevic
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« Reply #48 on: March 01, 2013, 01:22:28 PM »
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Russ, I very much like the Going West 2.

With a little bit of additional post-processing, it can be turned into an outstanding picture (again, that's just me, others might prefer it as-is). I especially like the almost black triangles on the sides of the road; reminds me of what AA did in his Moon Over Half Dome image.
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RSL
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« Reply #49 on: March 01, 2013, 02:43:47 PM »
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Slobodan you know I'm always interested to hear your post-processing suggestions on landscape. As I recall I agree with them more often than not. I do agree about the nearly black triangle. We used to have a triangle like that west of our house when we lived in Colorado Springs. You'd climb a slight hill and as you approached the triangle Pikes Peak would rise up in front of your eyes. Then they built on the sides of the triangle.
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« Reply #50 on: March 01, 2013, 03:27:59 PM »
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How about the school that says that cloning out a major element of an image is one step too far in manipulation? Veracity tends to have a virtue of its own.

You missed my point. I agree with you regarding veracity, but it's not about cloning; it's about whether the image is better without the FedEx logo. I say it is.

If it were my photo I would chalk it up as a learning experience, but I don't know if I'd bother cloning out the logo.
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nemo295
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« Reply #51 on: March 01, 2013, 03:28:38 PM »
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As far as closing the thread is concerned, if it gets nasty I'll try to beat Chris to the punch.

If it does get nasty, it will be on someone else's head, not mine.
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Slobodan Blagojevic
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« Reply #52 on: March 01, 2013, 03:55:11 PM »
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A quick attempt, perhaps overboard:
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Slobodan

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nemo295
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« Reply #53 on: March 01, 2013, 03:58:09 PM »
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A quick attempt, perhaps overboard:

Overall, I prefer the composition of this image to that of the first truck shot. And I like the way the hills pop in your version of it.
« Last Edit: March 01, 2013, 03:59:46 PM by Doug Frost » Logged
Slobodan Blagojevic
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« Reply #54 on: March 01, 2013, 03:59:04 PM »
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... As far as closing the thread is concerned, if it gets nasty...

Sorry, but I do not get it... closing, nasty?... what are you guys talking about? Everything I've seen looks pretty civil so far. Am I missing something?
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Slobodan

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« Reply #55 on: March 01, 2013, 04:03:18 PM »
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Sorry, but I do not get it... closing, nasty?... what are you guys talking about? Everything I've seen looks pretty civil so far. Am I missing something?

I think people are a little jumpy after the flamewar that went down on the etiquette thread. Understandable.
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RSL
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« Reply #56 on: March 01, 2013, 05:08:34 PM »
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A quick attempt, perhaps overboard:

I like it. Okay, what did you do? I guess what I'd do is make a selection and a layer and then sharpen the layer.
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Slobodan Blagojevic
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« Reply #57 on: March 01, 2013, 05:50:40 PM »
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I like it. Okay, what did you do? I guess what I'd do is make a selection and a layer and then sharpen the layer.

Basically, just three GND filters in LR4, plus several finishing touches.

One GND covers the road (starts at the bottom) and reduces exposure by 2/3 f/stops and reduces contrast by -100%.

Before anyone freaks out at such a drastic change, it is worth noting that sliders in LR4 are adaptable, i.e., their intensity varies from image to image (i.e., adopts to the content) and also (I believe) takes into account other changes to the image. So, 100% change in LR4 is not the same as 100% change in earlier versions.

Next GND starts from the top and ends at the horizon: the same parameters as above, plus 80% clarity.

The third GND starts from the top and ends before the white clouds begin: contrast reduced -100% and exposure by a whole f/stop. This GND effectively sits on top of the second one and enhances the effect on clouds.

Finishing touches: light vignetting, slight warming up of the clouds, "black triangles" were masked to protect from too much clarity in the second GND, plus clarity further reduced for the while lines on the road. There was some overall noise reduction, and low-frequency minor sharpening. That's about it.
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Rob C
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« Reply #58 on: March 02, 2013, 03:41:49 AM »
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Anyone remember the sweetness of holding back and burning in with your own two hands? (I speak of printing.)

;-)

Rob C
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Robert Roaldi
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« Reply #59 on: March 02, 2013, 05:46:05 AM »
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That's the point I was trying to make. But, equally, it's not an advertising shot: it's Russ making a sentimental statement that works because of the emotional reaction his location and treatment evoke as response. As was pointed out, without logo there's no emotional response at all and, ergo, no picture.

Rob C


It's too bad we can't experiment in two parallel universes. In the other one, it would have been fun to have Russ take a similar picture, only this time the truck that happened to come by would NOT have a logo on the back. Would forum critics have then encouraged him to clone in some company's logo to make a more powerful picture?

Too bad the interweb is so well, universal. If it weren't, then theoretically, one could post a logo-less picture on another, but similar forum, to see the reaction there. One could try but I doubt it would work, too easy to use google, find this thread and taint the opinion pool.


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