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Author Topic: Sekonic meter  (Read 1846 times)
KevinA
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« on: March 28, 2013, 06:38:00 AM »
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As I've been using a tilt shift on my Canon, when shifted the meter becomes useless. I was wondering about getting a Sekonic and profiling it to the camera and shifted lens.Judging the exposure by chimping is ok but not on the nail.
I'm hand holding in a moving environment, not tripod or tethered.
Any thoughts on this idea?
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Kevin.
BernardLanguillier
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« Reply #1 on: March 28, 2013, 07:02:37 AM »
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As I've been using a tilt shift on my Canon, when shifted the meter becomes useless. I was wondering about getting a Sekonic and profiling it to the camera and shifted lens.Judging the exposure by chimping is ok but not on the nail.
I'm hand holding in a moving environment, not tripod or tethered.
Any thoughts on this idea?

I have never actually measured whether the problem was just the meter or really the fact that, the light path being modified, the amount of light reaching the sensor is reduced.

If it is the former, then you could indeed just take an incident or reflected meter reading an use your camera in M Mode. If it is the latter, then things are a bit more complex because chances are that the amout of shift/tilt has an influence, which make a single calibration point useless.

The choice of incident vs reflected will depend on how close you are to your subject, whether you are in the same light or not. If you are incident is probably better since it removes the need to compensate for suject reflectance.

Cheers,
Bernard
« Last Edit: March 28, 2013, 08:32:55 AM by BernardLanguillier » Logged

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MarkL
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« Reply #2 on: March 28, 2013, 08:15:03 AM »
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Set the exposure before shifting?
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KevinA
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« Reply #3 on: March 28, 2013, 08:50:11 AM »
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I have never actually measured whether the problem was just the meter or really the fact that, the light path being modified, the amount of light reaching the sensor is reduced.

If it is the former, then you could indeed just take an incident or reflected meter reading an use your camera in M Mode. If it is the latter, then things are a bit more complex because chances are that the amout of shift/tilt has an influence, which make a single calibration point useless.

The choice of incident vs reflected will depend on how close you are to your subject, whether you are in the same light or not. If you are incident is probably better since it removes the need to compensate for suject reflectance.

Cheers,
Bernard



Manual doesn't work for a reading, if I set it to what the camera thinks it should be it's way way over exposed by a number of stops.
I'm in a helicopter when using it, so focus and shift I like to keep locked.
Setting everything to zero for a reading is fiddly. Incident readings are not an easy option. I will most likely end up using a spot meter pointed at grass.
I wondered wether Sekonics claims for measuring dr etc are just marketing hype, if not then maybe this is an ideal situation for it.
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Ellis Vener
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« Reply #4 on: March 28, 2013, 10:25:24 AM »
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I wondered wether Sekonics claims for measuring dr etc are just marketing hype, if not then maybe this is an ideal situation for it.


It's not hype but  I would try this first: use the camera's meter as guide shoot a good exposure without shifting the lens and with the camera at the same settings shift the lens  and see if the severe over exposure occurs . If it does you have a problem with the lens, probably in the wiring.

Also  which metering mode do you have the camera set to, spot, average or evaluative?

Out of my own curiousity why are you shifting the lens during your aerials? 
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Ellis Vener
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DougScott
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« Reply #5 on: March 28, 2013, 11:03:11 AM »
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Hi Kevin.

I think you're on a good track. Here's what you could do to get set up...
1. On the ground, compose a scene with desired shift
2. Use handheld spot meter for the brightest highlights you want to preserve
3. Enable highlight alert on your camera
4. Make several captures starting with +1 (relative to your meter reading) and increasing to +2 or more (overexposed)
5. When highlight alert warns you, back off as necessary
6. Look at the results in post-production
7. Make note of how many stops over the handheld meter's reading you actually just save those important highlights.

In doing the above just once, you have roughly calibrated your meter to your sensor's ability to preserve highlights. Once in the air, and on subsequent shoots, you can confidently expose to the right with only a single meter reading before you start shooting, maximizing your image quality for all captures of a particular scene. Simply meter the must-save highlights and open up the number of stops determined in #7 above. You will not be relying on the camera's meter confused by your shifted lens, and you can always take a quick look for your blinking highlights to confirm.

Alternately, if you have no other need for the handheld meter, you can just use the highlight blinkies to establish exposure.

djs
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Vladimirovich
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« Reply #6 on: March 28, 2013, 01:00:41 PM »
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As I've been using a tilt shift on my Canon, when shifted the meter becomes useless. I was wondering about getting a Sekonic and profiling it to the camera and shifted lens.Judging the exposure by chimping is ok but not on the nail.
I'm hand holding in a moving environment, not tripod or tethered.
Any thoughts on this idea?

you can use some cheap, used P&S camera for metering - just test how its metering works vs your Canon w/ such lens... no need to pay for Seconic.
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KevinA
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« Reply #7 on: March 28, 2013, 02:32:54 PM »
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It's not hype but  I would try this first: use the camera's meter as guide shoot a good exposure without shifting the lens and with the camera at the same settings shift the lens  and see if the severe over exposure occurs . If it does you have a problem with the lens, probably in the wiring.

Also  which metering mode do you have the camera set to, spot, average or evaluative?

Out of my own curiousity why are you shifting the lens during your aerials? 
Lots of tall buildings, I've been using prime 24mm and I'm getting a bit bored with leaning buildings. ......And no Photoshop is not much of an option you lose to much.
I'm hand holding so I don't get it perfect, but it looks so much nicer to me than the none shifted, here is my first go http://kevinallen.photodeck.com/-/galleries/24mm-ts/-/medias/395904ce-8c02-11e2-8e36-d940fb80ff6a
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Kevin.
KevinA
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« Reply #8 on: March 28, 2013, 02:44:00 PM »
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Hi Kevin.

I think you're on a good track. Here's what you could do to get set up...
1. On the ground, compose a scene with desired shift
2. Use handheld spot meter for the brightest highlights you want to preserve
3. Enable highlight alert on your camera
4. Make several captures starting with +1 (relative to your meter reading) and increasing to +2 or more (overexposed)
5. When highlight alert warns you, back off as necessary
6. Look at the results in post-production
7. Make note of how many stops over the handheld meter's reading you actually just save those important highlights.

In doing the above just once, you have roughly calibrated your meter to your sensor's ability to preserve highlights. Once in the air, and on subsequent shoots, you can confidently expose to the right with only a single meter reading before you start shooting, maximizing your image quality for all captures of a particular scene. Simply meter the must-save highlights and open up the number of stops determined in #7 above. You will not be relying on the camera's meter confused by your shifted lens, and you can always take a quick look for your blinking highlights to confirm.

Alternately, if you have no other need for the handheld meter, you can just use the highlight blinkies to establish exposure.

djs

Good idea, I'll get some batteries for my old Pentax spot and see how it works. Work out a mid point and a highlight.
Does anyone know why the meter stops working when the lens is shifted?
Focus conformation gives up as well.
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Kevin.
Roman Racela
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« Reply #9 on: March 29, 2013, 02:21:08 PM »
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I have a 24mm TS-E II and use a Sekonic spot meter. If you are using the camera's meter, then you have to meter before you tilt and/or shift and your captures will always look fine. Each time you recompose, you have to put the lens to it's default position/setting (zero tilt, zero shift). If you're using a Sekonic spot meter, then it doesn't really matter if your lens is shifted or tilted. You just plug in the numbers your Sekonic meter gives you...well, I add +2 stops after metering the brightest area of the scene with my handheld meter. Your Canon 7D, 5D Mk2 or 5D Mk3 should have at least an additional 2 to 2.5 stops above that reading before you blow out your highlights.

I hope this helps. Smiley
« Last Edit: March 29, 2013, 02:36:07 PM by Roman Racela » Logged
Roman Racela
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« Reply #10 on: March 29, 2013, 02:35:28 PM »
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Not sure why it does that. I've never noticed since I use the handheld meter or the lens is in the default position when using the camera's meter.

Use Liveview to focus as much as possible. You'll get sharper images that way.


Good idea, I'll get some batteries for my old Pentax spot and see how it works. Work out a mid point and a highlight.
Does anyone know why the meter stops working when the lens is shifted?
Focus conformation gives up as well.
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markmullen
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« Reply #11 on: March 30, 2013, 05:54:43 PM »
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I use the live view live histogram to meter with tilt and shift applied.
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Peter Barnes
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« Reply #12 on: April 02, 2013, 08:28:08 PM »
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What Mark said - except I don't need to check the histogram, because using Live View (stills only setting) on my 5DII I get accurate exposure every time, regardless of how much shift my 17mmTSE or 24mmTSE is set to.  I have the exposure problems mentioned above only when Live View is off and I am using the viewfinder. No idea why the difference. I often use these lenses handheld, adjusting the shift as I go, camera set to Aperture priority. Having never shot from a helicopter I don't know how feasible it is to use the back screen instead of the viewfinder while up there.
« Last Edit: April 02, 2013, 09:01:04 PM by Peter Barnes » Logged

Peter Barnes
KevinA
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« Reply #13 on: April 08, 2013, 10:19:40 AM »
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Not sure why it does that. I've never noticed since I use the handheld meter or the lens is in the default position when using the camera's meter.

Use Liveview to focus as much as possible. You'll get sharper images that way.


live view from an aircraft is impossible to use, great on a tripod hopeless when bouncing around.
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Kevin.
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