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Author Topic: Out-Gasing on Premium Lustre  (Read 3859 times)
Mike Guilbault
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« on: April 09, 2013, 01:15:20 PM »
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How long should you let a print cure before placing behind glass to avoid out-basing?  (using Epson UltraChrome HDR inks).
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Paul2660
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« Reply #1 on: April 09, 2013, 01:33:01 PM »
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Mike

I have found it varies by ink load in that a print with a lot of solid colors especially blacks will take longer. 
I try to wait at least 5 days and set the print up to dry with newspaper on top to help wick out the glycols.  Newspaper works great and will not transfer to the print.  Laying a sheet of glass on top will also help.

You can try heating the back of the print to speed up the process or set the print in a heat press for about 5 minutes at about 185 degrees. 

Out gassing is the only real issue I have with RC paper.

Paul Caldwell

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Paul Caldwell
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Mike Guilbault
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« Reply #2 on: April 09, 2013, 08:01:41 PM »
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wow.. that long!  I thought it was in the neighbourhood of 24 to 48 hours. 
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Wayne Fox
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« Reply #3 on: April 09, 2013, 08:17:01 PM »
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With Epson luster prints I have found a couple of days seems pretty safe.  It depends a little on room humidity and temperature, as well as whether there is anything to assist (such as some type of paper, air circulation, heat, etc).  It also depends on the frame/matting combination. We have many that leave our shop that are framed only 4 or 5 hours after printing, and really haven't seen any brought back with the glass fogged.  Most are double matted which may help since it can absorb some of the gas and moves the print further from the glass. . 

This is one reason I use EEF instead of luster.  costs a little more but has a little nicer texture, almost identical look, and because it's fiber I haven't seen the problem even if framing a few hours after printing.
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hugowolf
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« Reply #4 on: April 09, 2013, 09:39:10 PM »
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and because it's fiber I haven't seen the problem even if framing a few hours after printing.
What has fibre got to do with it? Both Epson Lustre and and Epson Exhibition Fiber are wood pulp fibre, and a paper like Canson Platine Fibre Rag is cotton fibre.

Brian A
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Schewe
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« Reply #5 on: April 09, 2013, 09:46:36 PM »
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What has fibre got to do with it? Both Epson Lustre and and Epson Exhibition Fiber are wood pulp fibre, and a paper like Canson Platine Fibre Rag is cotton fibre.

Luster is an RC/plastic coated paper and the ink on front can not outgas from the back of the paper because of the paper acting like a vapor barrier. EFP is a fiber based paper and the glycols can escape out the back of the paper much like watercolor paper.
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Mike Guilbault
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« Reply #6 on: April 09, 2013, 10:27:53 PM »
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thanks guys.. that helps quite a bit.
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bill t.
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« Reply #7 on: April 09, 2013, 10:33:02 PM »
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I only stopped having outgassing problems when I started dry mounting Premium Luster.  After three days air drying, one press without tissue to flatten and drive out moisture, then the attachment pass a few minutes later.

FWIW, am seeing noticeable fading on acrylic glazed and matted Premium Luster prints displayed in fluorescent lighted offices after about 4 to 5 years.  Coated and glue-mounted, OBA canvases in the same offices are still OK.
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Alan Goldhammer
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« Reply #8 on: April 10, 2013, 06:40:52 AM »
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@Paul2660 - I would not use newsprint to help in drying your prints.  Even though you might not see any ink transfer, newsprint is pretty acidic and could be causing other long term problems.  It's far better to get some acid-free interleaving paper and use that instead.  You can reuse it and it's not all that expensive.

@bill t - not surprised at all by the fading in an office setting.  I've got about 10 prints hanging up in my former employer's office and they are all now at the five year mark.  A couple of them are showing some slight fading but the ones on OBA-free paper seem to be doing quite well.  Most office lighting is pretty bad in terms of impact on prints.
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Paul2660
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« Reply #9 on: April 10, 2013, 10:18:26 AM »
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Alan:

Thanks for the tip, can you list some brand examples?   Newspaper is acidic for sure.

Mike,  the post on Epson EFP, is a good point.  It's also one of the only papers I have found in large sheets and every once and a while Atlex will have them on sale.  Someone already mentioned Canon Platine, I love it 100% cotton with a similar finish to Epson EFP.  Platine won't out gas to the front and has a nice semi-gloss finish.  You can also consider Canon's Baryta photographique paper, however it's alpha cellulose not 100% cotton.  I feel it has a more pure glossy finish, and it is very easy to scratch, either in the printer or when mounting. 

Also, Breathing Color's Vibrance Rag, a newer paper.  It's also 100% cotton, but has a more aggressive finish. 

Of course this is off topic as you are using RC paper.  All of them will out gas to some extent.  I have pulled back and remounted enough prints that for commercial work I no longer quote it, and use a fiber based paper.

Paul Caldwell
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Paul Caldwell
Little Rock, Arkansas U.S.
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Alan Goldhammer
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« Reply #10 on: April 10, 2013, 01:28:09 PM »
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Alan:

Thanks for the tip, can you list some brand examples?   Newspaper is acidic for sure.

Paul Caldwell

Paul, I purchase mine from Archival Methods and they have all popular sizes.

Alan
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Paul2660
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« Reply #11 on: April 10, 2013, 02:04:48 PM »
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Alan,

Thanks for the link, I will pursue these.

Paul Caldwell
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Paul Caldwell
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Mike Guilbault
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« Reply #12 on: April 10, 2013, 03:01:51 PM »
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Good points Paul.  I'm going to switch to a fibre based paper for this type of work.  Now I wish I hadn't bought that 24" roll of Premium Lustre!
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Alan Goldhammer
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« Reply #13 on: April 10, 2013, 05:25:26 PM »
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I may be in a minority but I absolutely love Museo Silver Rag, it's all cotton and has the best black of papers I've tested.
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hugowolf
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« Reply #14 on: April 10, 2013, 07:00:43 PM »
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Luster is an RC/plastic coated paper and the ink on front can not outgas from the back of the paper because of the paper acting like a vapor barrier. EFP is a fiber based paper and the glycols can escape out the back of the paper much like watercolor paper.
So the question here is not whether they are 'fibre based', but whether they are RC (plastic coated)? Cotton fibre or wood pulp fibre, it doesn't matter.

Brian A
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Mike Guilbault
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« Reply #15 on: April 10, 2013, 08:03:58 PM »
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Is there a fibre based paper available in 10"x100' (or any other length) rolls?  I print tons of 8x10s for corporate clients and  have been using the Premium Lustre.  What are the alternatives?  For the volume I print, I need rolls.
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hugowolf
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« Reply #16 on: April 10, 2013, 08:31:51 PM »
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Is there a fibre based paper available in 10"x100' (or any other length) rolls?  I print tons of 8x10s for corporate clients and  have been using the Premium Lustre.  What are the alternatives?  For the volume I print, I need rolls.
Off hand I can't even think of a 13 inch roll paper that isn't resin coated.

Brian A
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Mike Guilbault
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« Reply #17 on: April 10, 2013, 09:00:15 PM »
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That's what I was afraid of.
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jferrari
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« Reply #18 on: April 11, 2013, 05:55:39 AM »
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Is there a fibre based paper available in 10"x100' (or any other length) rolls?  I print tons of 8x10s for corporate clients and  have been using the Premium Lustre.  What are the alternatives?  For the volume I print, I need rolls.

Mike, use your 44" printer as it was designed. 4 up in the ten inch dimension and 5 up in the eight. Works perfectly.
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No, I don't own one. But I have seen one on TV.
Mike Guilbault
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« Reply #19 on: April 11, 2013, 11:14:52 AM »
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Problem with that is the cutting afterwards.  I don't have a large cutter, so the 10" roll required only one cut across the 10" width to produce perfect 8x10s. 
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