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Author Topic: Olympus E-M5  (Read 1716 times)
Glenn NK
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« on: April 17, 2013, 11:26:51 PM »
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Anybody using one and specifically has anyone compared it with the Fuji X-E1?

I've been to DPR several times and compared the RAW images (RAW quality compared) between these two, the Sony NEX-7, and my own 5DII - using the composite image with all the various bottles, colour charts, hair swatches, fuzzy balls, queen of hearts, paper clips, you-name-it.

There are variations across the image as to which particular camera is sharpest (quite possibly due to focusing and lenses), but overall the Oly seems to hold its own at various ISO values.   The Fuji samples have less noise with increasing ISO, but they seem to sacrifice sharpness.   The Sony is generally the loser with regard to noise.

1)  The white cross against the navy BG, at ISO 800, the Fuji is very close but the Sony and 5DII are showing their noise - particularly the Sony.

2)  Yellow hair against the black box (lower right), the Oly is the clear winner for sharpness and/or noise.

3)  Multi-coloured fuzzy balls just above Mickey Mouse is revealing - what happened to the Fuji?

I'm interested in other people's interpretation and comments of the DPR tests.

Glenn
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Vladimirovich
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« Reply #1 on: April 18, 2013, 02:58:18 PM »
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Anybody using one and specifically has anyone compared it with the Fuji X-E1?

I've been to DPR several times and compared the RAW images (RAW quality compared) between these two, the Sony NEX-7, and my own 5DII - using the composite image with all the various bottles, colour charts, hair swatches, fuzzy balls, queen of hearts, paper clips, you-name-it.

There are variations across the image as to which particular camera is sharpest (quite possibly due to focusing and lenses), but overall the Oly seems to hold its own at various ISO values.   The Fuji samples have less noise with increasing ISO, but they seem to sacrifice sharpness.   The Sony is generally the loser with regard to noise.

1)  The white cross against the navy BG, at ISO 800, the Fuji is very close but the Sony and 5DII are showing their noise - particularly the Sony.

2)  Yellow hair against the black box (lower right), the Oly is the clear winner for sharpness and/or noise.

3)  Multi-coloured fuzzy balls just above Mickey Mouse is revealing - what happened to the Fuji?

I'm interested in other people's interpretation and comments of the DPR tests.

Glenn


if you shoot raw your shall not use DPReview comparometer, they [1] do not use the same version of ACR for different tests [2] are not able to maintain proper illumination between tests (for various cameras) [3] ACR is using hidden expocorrections if Adobe's supplied .dcp profiles are used and as a raw shooter you shall not use manufacturer ISOs, but rather go by what DxO measures... that is if you really care.
« Last Edit: April 18, 2013, 03:01:40 PM by Vladimirovich » Logged
sunnycal
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« Reply #2 on: April 27, 2013, 03:00:27 PM »
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DPR also applies same sharpness to all camera. This obviously does not necessarily is the optimum value for each sensor.

I think their test scenario is as good as anything else out there for such general purpose comparison. I, however, download the RAW files and compare them in LR myself using optimum sharpness, noise reduction, and saturation.

About Fuji, I think the raw process for x-trans are still not there (even with recent updates). Because of this, I would take NEX-7 over Fuji (and OM-D over either), but the new Fuji zooms are reported to be really good and may tilt the balance in Fuji's favor.

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Deardorff
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« Reply #3 on: April 28, 2013, 07:32:13 AM »
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While a nice camera be sure you can live with the electronic viewfinders.

Some of us can't take using them.
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thefl
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« Reply #4 on: April 28, 2013, 02:06:05 PM »
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Anybody using one and specifically has anyone compared it with the Fuji X-E1?
I have and use an Olympus E-M5 and a Fuji X-E1. Both almost exclusively with their best prime lenses.

To make it short:

Image quality is pretty much equal. I usually get slightly better resolution with the E-M5 (perhaps a negative effect of the X-Trans), but the X-E1 has a slight edge concerning noise. All in all it's very hard seeing a difference when peeping and practically impossible when looking at prints.
Handling is where you will find the real difference. The E-M5 behaves like a small, very fast and responsive DSLR. The X-E1 more like a rangefinder with overall slower operation and a more basic, direct control layout. Both have their own charm and personal preference between these different layouts will most of all decide which of the two will suit you more.

They are both great cameras. If I could only keep one of them, I would definitely choose the E-M5 because of it's far superior versatility compared to the X-E1. I feel having to make more compromises and fighting their weak points with the Fujis, whereas the E-M5 is the first EVIL for me which manages to get completely out of the way (without making up workarounds) in the process of taking pictures.
« Last Edit: April 28, 2013, 02:12:32 PM by thefl » Logged
Glenn NK
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« Reply #5 on: April 28, 2013, 02:42:34 PM »
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Thanks to all for the replies - very helpful and appreciated.

One further question - "will the Panasonic lens based OIS, function on the Olympus E-M5?"  Olympus uses body IS.

Thanks.

Glenn
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thefl
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« Reply #6 on: April 28, 2013, 03:05:22 PM »
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One further question - "will the Panasonic lens based OIS, function on the Olympus E-M5?"  Olympus uses body IS.
Most Panasonic OIS lenses have a mechanical switch in the outside for switching OIS on or off. That way you can easily activate/deactivate it, also on Olympus cameras. The OIS will work just as good as it works on Panasonic cameras. Just make sure not using both (OIS and IS) at the same time as they will fight each other and lead to wobbly pictures.

Very few Panasonic OIS lenses don't have that mechanical switch, but OIS is controlled via the software menu in the Panasonic cameras. Those might pose a problem as the Oly cameras don't have that menu feature allowing control of OIS in lenses. But up to now, I think there is just one lens (Panasonic 14-42 pancake) leading to this incompatibility and all the others have mechanical switches on the outside.
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Glenn NK
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« Reply #7 on: April 28, 2013, 03:23:03 PM »
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Most Panasonic OIS lenses have a mechanical switch in the outside for switching OIS on or off. That way you can easily activate/deactivate it, also on Olympus cameras. The OIS will work just as good as it works on Panasonic cameras. Just make sure not using both (OIS and IS) at the same time as they will fight each other and lead to wobbly pictures.

Very few Panasonic OIS lenses don't have that mechanical switch, but OIS is controlled via the software menu in the Panasonic cameras. Those might pose a problem as the Oly cameras don't have that menu feature allowing control of OIS in lenses. But up to now, I think there is just one lens (Panasonic 14-42 pancake) leading to this incompatibility and all the others have mechanical switches on the outside.


Thanks.

So to summarize, the lens-IS of the Panasonic lens can't be used (switch ON), with the Olympus.

However, IF the Olympus camera had a switch to turn the body IS ON/OFF, then the Panasonic lens IS could be used.

Glenn
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sunnycal
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« Reply #8 on: April 28, 2013, 03:34:39 PM »
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In most cases Panasonic OIS can be used on Oly bodies. Just remember to turn off either the Lens OIS or Camera IBIS so as not to do double compensation.

The only exception is (was?) the new Panasonic G lens but I think as far as IS is concerned it will still work. The difference is that now you can not turn off Pansonic IS, so you have to turn off IBIS. The other problem is that G lenses require zoom buttons on body which Oly and older Panssonics do not have. I think that Oly has added some of this in its menus, though I am not sure.
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thefl
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« Reply #9 on: April 28, 2013, 03:37:45 PM »
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So to summarize, the lens-IS of the Panasonic lens can't be used (switch ON), with the Olympus.

However, IF the Olympus camera had a switch to turn the body IS ON/OFF, then the Panasonic lens IS could be used.
No, there seems to be a misunderstanding.

The Olympus cameras of course have a (software) switch for turning their own body IS on/off. Just switch body IS off and activate OIS on the Panasonic lens via the mechanical switch on the lens. So you can use Panasonics lens based OIS without any problem at all. Works perfectly the same as it would on a Panasonic camera.

But some (maybe just the one mentioned) Panasonic lenses do not have a mechanical OIS switch on the lens itself. Their OIS has to be activated/deactivated in the camera menu. Panasonic cameras do have such a menu feature of course, but Olympus cameras do not have the menu option for controlling OIS of Panasonic lenses. So only if the Panasonic OIS lens does not have an external OIS switch on the lens barrel, you can not control OIS on an Olympus camera. As mentioned, I think up to now only one Panasonic lens has this disadvantage - so all the others' OIS function can be used without any problem on any Olympus camera.

But in most cases Olympus IS is more efficient than the lens based OIS anyway...   Wink
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Glenn NK
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« Reply #10 on: April 28, 2013, 05:45:33 PM »
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Some Panasonic G lenses seem to have a switch:

http://www.photozone.de/m43/766_pana1235f28

http://www.photozone.de/olympus--four-thirds-lens-tests/414-pana_1445_3556

http://www.photozone.de/olympus--four-thirds-lens-tests/682-pana14140

Some Panasonic G lenses don't seem to have a switch:

http://www.photozone.de/olympus--four-thirds-lens-tests/530-pana_714_4

http://www.photozone.de/olympus--four-thirds-lens-tests/721-pana45175

http://www.photozone.de/olympus--four-thirds-lens-tests/615-pana1442

One would think the switches would all be in the same position (logical?), so if the switch isn't visible (in the Photozone review pics), then there likely isn't one.

However, whether or not the lens has a switch, as long as turning off the IS on the Olympus body isn't too much of a hassle, the combination of Olympus body + Panasonic lens should be workable.

I think I'm slowly getting there - it's a bit of a hassle compared to Canon (my current bodies and lenses), what with Canon's superb selection of lenses that are fully compatible (not to mention other compatibles like Tamron, Sigma, Zeiss, Tokina).

Glenn
« Last Edit: April 28, 2013, 05:48:37 PM by Glenn NK » Logged

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thefl
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« Reply #11 on: April 29, 2013, 07:01:51 AM »
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Some Panasonic G lenses don't seem to have a switch:
http://www.photozone.de/olympus--four-thirds-lens-tests/530-pana_714_4
The 7-14 doesn't have OIS, so no switch. Wink

I think I'm slowly getting there - it's a bit of a hassle compared to Canon (my current bodies and lenses), what with Canon's superb selection of lenses that are fully compatible (not to mention other compatibles like Tamron, Sigma, Zeiss, Tokina).
Well, apart from third party manufacturers only Canon makes lenses for Canon cameras. But you have two first party suppliers for mFT, Olympus and Panasonic and they for some reason chose a different approach to stabilization systems. Olympus' lenses also have no problem with Olympus cameras, as Panasonic's don't have any with Panasonic cameras. But I agree, a better definition of this one standard regarding such details (like CA-reduction) wouldn't have hurt either.

And yes, I agree Canon has a great selection of lenses. For their full frame cameras. For their cropped cameras it's pretty much horrible, as there are only very few APS-C optimized lenses and they are mostly consumer oriented. Sure, you can also use full frame lenses on APS-C, but then why having APS-C in the first place? Just for a slightly smaller camera and still having to lug all that unnecessary big/heavy FF designed glass for no reason at all? Mehh...
« Last Edit: April 29, 2013, 07:04:29 AM by thefl » Logged
BJL
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« Reply #12 on: April 29, 2013, 07:43:03 AM »
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I think I'm slowly getting there - it's a bit of a hassle compared to Canon ...
Here is the simple version:
  • Every m4/3 lens with in-lens IS allows that IS to be used with any m4/3 body.
  • Every Olympus m4/3 body provides in-body IS, and this can be used with any lens, including any third party lenses mounted through an adaptor (try getting IS with a Canon body and non-IS lens attached!)
  • When both body and lens have IS, you should use one and turn the other off, and it is always possible to turn of the in-body IS of an Olympus body through the menus.
  • If the OIS lens has an IS switch on it, then you have the added option of turning of  the lens IS and using the in-body IS.
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