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Author Topic: Adobe diverging Creative Cloud and Standard versions  (Read 86346 times)
bill t.
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« on: May 06, 2013, 12:56:11 PM »
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Some arm twisting for you Creative Cloud holdouts.  Better open the windows, it's gonna get hot in here.

http://www.dpreview.com/news/2013/05/06/Adobe-offers-creative-cloud-subscription-updates
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Mark D Segal
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« Reply #1 on: May 06, 2013, 01:36:49 PM »
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And the Adobe cash register may just cool-down.
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Mark D Segal (formerly MarkDS)
Author: "Scanning Workflows with SilverFast 8....." http://www.luminous-landscape.com/reviews/film/scanning_workflows_with_silverfast_8.shtml
Chris_Brown
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« Reply #2 on: May 06, 2013, 01:42:04 PM »
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Gotta look good for those shareholders.
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Schewe
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« Reply #3 on: May 06, 2013, 01:45:35 PM »
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Better open the windows, it's gonna get hot in here.

Yep...
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Mark D Segal
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« Reply #4 on: May 06, 2013, 01:45:55 PM »
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Gotta look good for those shareholders.

It's going to be interesting. The economics of it remain to be seen. The monthly subscription cost is about twice what it costs to pay USD 200 on each 18 month upgrade cycle. The key issue is whether enough people will go for this to keep the shareholders smiling, or how many will just stop upgrading because they fell they have all the image processing power they really need.
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Mark D Segal (formerly MarkDS)
Author: "Scanning Workflows with SilverFast 8....." http://www.luminous-landscape.com/reviews/film/scanning_workflows_with_silverfast_8.shtml
AFairley
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« Reply #5 on: May 06, 2013, 01:47:09 PM »
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No non-subscription CS7.  http://www.dpreview.com/news/2013/05/06/Adobe-kills-perpetual-licenses-as-creative-suite-moves-to-creative-cloud-cc

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john beardsworth
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« Reply #6 on: May 06, 2013, 01:52:11 PM »
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Exactly. It's subscribe or else.

The press release is pretty amusing. A lot of "we believe" and this is what we are going to do. ,
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Chris_Brown
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« Reply #7 on: May 06, 2013, 01:54:21 PM »
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This letter from Adobe says it all. Either get in or get off the bus.
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Schewe
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« Reply #8 on: May 06, 2013, 02:02:47 PM »
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The monthly subscription cost is about twice what it costs to pay USD 200 on each 18 month upgrade cycle.

Actually, they announced new aggressive upgrade pricing to the CC versions of apps which brings the price down-assuming you go with a longer term license.

Special pricing for existing customers
CS3 and later get Complete for $29.99
CS6 customers get Complete for $19.99
CS3 and later get Single App for $9.99
All offers require annual commitment

As far as the economics of the CC for Adobe, actually, it's been the success of the whole subscription model (and the technical difficulty in doing dual application versioning for subscription & perpetual licenses) that have driven Adobe toward doing this. Yes, it will alienate some users who reject the whole "cloud" thingie...which I understand (assuming the rejection is made based on real facts and not FUD).

As a book author, my life just way more complicated because I can't write for a fixed target with a known lifecycle...now it's a moving target that will be tough to do for paper based publishing (easier and perhaps better done with ebooks).

I'm also kinda melancholy about the whole change to the old model...as a long term alpha/beta tester, I always looked forward to a new dev cycle and seeing what the engineers came up with (and hammered on them to fix stuff). But this new model allows a freedom and flexibility that will, I think, lead to more rapid advances with new features on a more regular basis. But I'll miss the old way...

Edited to add the special offers...
« Last Edit: May 06, 2013, 02:06:00 PM by Schewe » Logged
Kirk Gittings
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« Reply #9 on: May 06, 2013, 02:10:01 PM »
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I hope to hell you are right. I hate with a passion adding more fixed monthly overheard that I have no control over to my operation.
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bill t.
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« Reply #10 on: May 06, 2013, 02:21:04 PM »
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Whatever else, I'll forgive almost anything in exchange for having ACR as an in-application Photoshop filter.  Woohoo!  That's been at the top of my wish list for a long time.

Glad to see the single app price scheme, since a lot of working photographers never get past LR/PS.

Bottom line...if this means Adobe can now "afford" to shine a new spotlight on poor, neglected CC-PS, I'm all for it.
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Steve Weldon
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« Reply #11 on: May 06, 2013, 02:27:22 PM »
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I wouldn't be surprised if an antitrust suit is filed.

Meanwhile.. how long before Adobe declares our current licenses null and void and finds a way to disable them.  They're not past silent updates..
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Adam L
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« Reply #12 on: May 06, 2013, 02:35:34 PM »
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I'm not clear on what happens after you cancel a subscription.  IF it leaves you with a working copy but stops all future enhancements it will be much better received in the marketplace.   If it turns off and you're not able to use it, forcing you back to CS6 then it will likely open the market for competition.

A $20 bill every month is a reminder that you're paying to use something.  If you're not getting your $20 worth every month you'll fall into the casual user category, and perhaps will cancel the subscription.

As some of you know, I work in the cloud space.   We're trying very hard to move physical hosting clients to the cloud.  It's not easy unless they have a compelling reason to make the move.   I suspect the same will prove true here.

FYI, I'll move to the subscription model but would likely do so for just PS, choosing to drop the rest of the creative suite.   Is LR also moving in this direction with LR5?
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Mark D Segal
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« Reply #13 on: May 06, 2013, 02:39:22 PM »
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I wouldn't be surprised if an antitrust suit is filed.

Meanwhile.. how long before Adobe declares our current licenses null and void and finds a way to disable them.  They're not past silent updates..

What conceivable basis is there for filing an antitrust suit? To win an anti-trust suit you need to prove that companies with a dominant market position have conspired with each other to frustrate competition. How on earth could Adobe be violating anything in the competition laws by changing their business model from converting their customers into renters rather than owners?

As for voiding existing licenses - another story - that could perhaps invoke breach of contract, but before getting there, one had perhaps better read the fine print in the contract - maybe they have outs, I don't know because I've never needed to bother.
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Mark D Segal (formerly MarkDS)
Author: "Scanning Workflows with SilverFast 8....." http://www.luminous-landscape.com/reviews/film/scanning_workflows_with_silverfast_8.shtml
john beardsworth
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« Reply #14 on: May 06, 2013, 02:42:06 PM »
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 Is LR also moving in this direction with LR5?
No, see  http://blogs.adobe.com/lightroomjournal/2013/05/lightroom-and-the-creative-cloud.html . But it doesn't say what the price will be to buy it.
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Mark D Segal
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« Reply #15 on: May 06, 2013, 02:49:30 PM »
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Actually, they announced new aggressive upgrade pricing to the CC versions of apps which brings the price down-assuming you go with a longer term license.

Special pricing for existing customers
CS3 and later get Complete for $29.99
CS6 customers get Complete for $19.99
CS3 and later get Single App for $9.99
All offers require annual commitment

As far as the economics of the CC for Adobe, actually, it's been the success of the whole subscription model (and the technical difficulty in doing dual application versioning for subscription & perpetual licenses) that have driven Adobe toward doing this. Yes, it will alienate some users who reject the whole "cloud" thingie...which I understand (assuming the rejection is made based on real facts and not FUD).

As a book author, my life just way more complicated because I can't write for a fixed target with a known lifecycle...now it's a moving target that will be tough to do for paper based publishing (easier and perhaps better done with ebooks).

I'm also kinda melancholy about the whole change to the old model...as a long term alpha/beta tester, I always looked forward to a new dev cycle and seeing what the engineers came up with (and hammered on them to fix stuff). But this new model allows a freedom and flexibility that will, I think, lead to more rapid advances with new features on a more regular basis. But I'll miss the old way...

Edited to add the special offers...

I don't reject the CC concept out of hand, but I must say I have reservations about becoming a renter rather than an owner. As an owner, the day I stop upgrading I always have the last version for which I bought a license. With the new approach, whenever I stop renting, I must revert to CS6.

As for the incentive pricing - well, like cheap mortgage rates and introductory cell-phone services - let's see what they do in "round two". It may not be so pretty.

Your comment on the implications for authors is indeed an intriguing issue. It's a continually moving target, so what you'd be writing "about" is kinda like nailing jelly to a wall - unless you change the concept. For example, once they've accumulated enough new features that you've had a chance to do innovative things with that are worth telling the world about, you can justify an ebook explaining them. Indeed a whole new way of life.
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Mark D Segal (formerly MarkDS)
Author: "Scanning Workflows with SilverFast 8....." http://www.luminous-landscape.com/reviews/film/scanning_workflows_with_silverfast_8.shtml
Walt Roycraft
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« Reply #16 on: May 06, 2013, 03:10:23 PM »
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Actually, they announced new aggressive upgrade pricing to the CC versions of apps which brings the price down-assuming you go with a longer term license.

Special pricing for existing customers
CS3 and later get Complete for $29.99
CS6 customers get Complete for $19.99
CS3 and later get Single App for $9.99
All offers require annual commitment

This is for 12 months...Increase after that
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Tim Lookingbill
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« Reply #17 on: May 06, 2013, 03:18:16 PM »
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I think the Adobe Letter scared me more than my first impressions of the subscription route of "renting" instead of "owning" (a license, not software).

Did anyone make heads or tales of the bullet points outlining the concept of the CC. It reads like someone describing the "Matrix".

Quote
•Your assets, settings, styles, colors, and fonts are synced and available across your desktop and mobile devices

Why does this need to be synced? Who's responsible when it doesn't sync as intended and what happens with the "Assets" when they're damaged or lost up in the clouds due maybe to the syncing going awry or some other "bug". I bet the contract on this is going to read like an At&t contract subscription.

I got out and stayed out of graphics for print ad and publishing for over a decade when I saw the digital writing on the wall where the real control and responsibilities of efficient workflows were now taken mostly out of the hands of the Art/Creative Director (who had to wear many hats) and placed in the hands of software designers and authors.

This CC approach appears to address a more efficient way to deal with the complexity of various workflows by having "One Ring Rules Them All".

Quote
•You are able to share your work and get feedback from the community throughout the creative process

What is this community and why don't I see it. It sounds like a Facebook experience where it appears there's a community but the UI creates confusion behind deciphering the intent behind the exchanges. Is she "REALLY" into me or is she just being sociable to save face in front of millions of people online" kind of thingy.

Why do I want to share my work? And why would I want it judged from people viewing it on a mobile device?

Good lord! Am I glad I got out of graphics when I did!
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Schewe
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« Reply #18 on: May 06, 2013, 03:26:14 PM »
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I wouldn't be surprised if an antitrust suit is filed.

I would...there's no basis.

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Meanwhile.. how long before Adobe declares our current licenses null and void and finds a way to disable them.  They're not past silent updates..

FUD isn't useful doode...in fact, recent behavior by Adobe indicates the exact opposite. You'll note that due to technical and security issues, the old Photoshop CS2 activation servers had to be taken down. So, what did Adobe do? The made the entire CR2 suite available for users and gave them serial numbers that didn't require activation–knowing full well a whole bunch of people who DID'T have a CS2 license would help themselves to the freebie (and they did).

It would be more useful if you actually kept things in the realm of reality when discussing this topic. Spreading FUD may be fun for you, but it doesn't anybody else any favors...
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Schewe
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« Reply #19 on: May 06, 2013, 03:28:29 PM »
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Why do I want to share my work? And why would I want it judged from people viewing it on a mobile device?

Good lord! Am I glad I got out of graphics when I did!

Well, you said it, you aren't working in the field now...you don't have clients spread out all over the place with contract artists also spread out everywhere. It's a wired world bud (if you hadn't noticed) and "graphics" as an industry have undergone a revolution since you've been in it. That's why you don't understand...
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