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Author Topic: Phase Wake Up Cable Options?  (Read 1236 times)
JoeKitchen
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« on: June 02, 2013, 10:38:28 AM »
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My current workflow when using the SK 35mm is to (1) compose the image, (2) sync the back to the lens and my pocket wizard to the back, (3) put on the center filter, (4) set the ISO to 200, (5) balance and stage the image, (6) set the ISO back to 50 [so far, so good, but this is where it gets annoying], (7) sync the back to the Kapture Group Multi-shot Adapter, (8 ) remove the P1 cable from the lens and sync the Pocket Wizard to the lens, and (9) capture the image using multiple exposures.  

Removing the P1 cable and syncing the Pocket Wizard to the lens when the CF is on is quite annoying.  My optimal set up would be to sync the Pocket Wizard to the lens, and sync the back to the Wizard at the beginning, allowing me not to have to fool around with the lens when I ready for the final capture.  However, Pocket Wizards do not have a PC outlet (and my strobes have built in Pocket Wizards), only female audio jack outlets.  

Does Phase make a wake cable with a male audio jack instead of the PC connector?  Or is there a way to sync a PC adapter to an female audio jack?
« Last Edit: June 02, 2013, 10:40:26 AM by JoeKitchen » Logged

Joe Kitchen
www.josephmkitchen.com

"Photography is one percent inspiration and ninety-nine percent moving furniture."  Arnold Newman
"Try not to be just better than your rivals and contemporaries, try to be better than yourself."  William Faulkner
julienlanoo
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« Reply #1 on: June 02, 2013, 11:36:13 AM »
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mhm, i would like to help you,
but i don't get your question,

What do you want to achieve ? ? exactly ? ..
as it seems to me you're going form Brussels to Rome via a 24h flight to Honkong and then again 8h to Melbourn to arrive 3 days later in Rome .. :p:p

If you want to sync flashes via pocket wizzard, you cloud do the following. ( as i do)
Setup your lens and back with the Kapture Group sync cable for phase one.

Then > look at your back just above where you plug in the Kapture groupe sync end in your back , you will find a x-synchro flash plug. you can plug in your Pocket wizard with a standard cable in there .. just the same result..

If you do not trust a standard pocket wizard cable you can get the same cable but with a resistor ( little block) in the middle of it protecting it completely..

option 2,
You can use a "x-sync flash splitter " like we used before the RF's and IR syncs. and 1 that goes to the back sync and one that goes to the Pocket wizard, but why would you do that ? .. Smiley

if you could explain more what you would like to achieve , i might have better solutions Smiley

greets
ju
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JoeKitchen
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« Reply #2 on: June 02, 2013, 12:17:15 PM »
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This is what I would like to do, sync the lens to the Pocket Wizard, and then sync the Pocket Wizard to the back via  Wake Up Cable.  I want to do this so I do not have to fool around with changing the sync on the lens while shooting. 

As of now, I have only been able to find a Wake Up Cable that has a PC connector on it and my Pocket Wizards do not have a PC outlet.  I was wondering is Phase make a Wake Up cable with a audio jack at one end instead of the standard PC connector. 
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Joe Kitchen
www.josephmkitchen.com

"Photography is one percent inspiration and ninety-nine percent moving furniture."  Arnold Newman
"Try not to be just better than your rivals and contemporaries, try to be better than yourself."  William Faulkner
julienlanoo
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« Reply #3 on: June 02, 2013, 01:46:49 PM »
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Well,

The question is, why would you want to work the way you discribe? i understand what you want to do, but not why. And it's the why that's important here to help you out..

2 points

1 - As a PC connection is quit a simple 1 way connection, that's simple to make, ( as you only have to have a "MONO" audiojack to do it - if you take a stereo audio jack that would be a bit more complex to solder, not that more but you'll have to look more carefully).. Just take a PC with cut of the 'male' part and solder the + and - to the + and _ from your Audio jack ( MONO)

2-
ONLY
that wouldn't be a good idea, because the "digital back" needs at the end of its latency, ( or to now when to end its latency) a "sign" the image has been made. And phase one ( not hasselblad, as you can set exposure times in the back) uses the shutter closing for this. What happens when the shutter closes is that the "flash" synchro connection is freed again, and then the back assumes the image has been made.

If you realy want to do it, you would have to make a By-pass of the pocket wizard, ( just like the kapture group bypasses the latency wake shot) . that's not that difficult to make only need the correct components and a good solder pen.

If you want for some reason to "end" your exposure before the actual shutter closes ( and thus use your back as a shutter) i could only see this work with long exposures, and then the "solder your own cable , link to pocket then to phase, system could work.. But why? ..



I don't see exactly why you would want to do this, as there is a flash sync ( X , or female PC connection) on your back.
Connect the Lens shutter flash sync to your back via the phase cable, ( or capture groupe), and then connect your pocket wizard to your back, Your pocket wizard will sync exatly on the same time as it wold on the lens ..

If you want a "retard" function , you can to this with the Pocket Wizard functionality ( if you have a multimax or similar) ...  This way you can also flash sync at the "end" of your exposure instead of the beginning..

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julienlanoo
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« Reply #4 on: June 02, 2013, 01:57:01 PM »
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by the way,
Phase One did not invent that connection, that's a "normal" Canon connection ( just like their batteries are),
Pocket wizard delivers cables with the same connection for Canon gear syncs: http://www.pocketwizard.com/products/cable_accessory/cameracables/cm-n3-p/

http://www.pocketwizard.com/products/cable_accessory/cameracables/cm-n3/

http://www.pocketwizard.com/products/cable_accessory/cameracables/cm-n3-acc/


don't know if it will work though with your back,
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JoeKitchen
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« Reply #5 on: June 02, 2013, 02:03:54 PM »
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Here's the reason.  I do not have enough strobe power to balance my images with the center filter on at ISO 50.  So I need to balance the shot at ISO 200 and than do multiple exposures at ISO 50.  At ISO 200, I have the back synced to the lens and the Pocket Wizard synced to the back.  At ISO 50, I than sync the back to the KG Multi-shot Device.  Since the back is no longer synced to the lens, the PC outlet on the back will not fire the Pocket Wizard when I am doing the multiple exposures.  So I need to now remove the Wake Up cable from the lens and sync the Pocket Wizard to the lens.  This is quite annoying to do when the CF is on the lens.  

I was hoping there would be a way to sync the PW to the lens, and the Back to the PW through the "out."  Than to grab the final capture, all I would need to do would be to un-sync the back from the PW and plug in the Multi-shot.  I would not have to fool around with the lens since it is already synced to the PW.  

I shot with a P45+ and need the wake up button on anything I connect to the back. 
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Joe Kitchen
www.josephmkitchen.com

"Photography is one percent inspiration and ninety-nine percent moving furniture."  Arnold Newman
"Try not to be just better than your rivals and contemporaries, try to be better than yourself."  William Faulkner
julienlanoo
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« Reply #6 on: June 02, 2013, 02:12:34 PM »
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Aha, ! now i get it ...

Mhm, interesting problem to solve, ...
I don't think for sure the way you described would work,
I think the solution lies in to a "parallel" connection from flash sync to back and to PW,
with some thing like this:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Flash-PC-Sync-Splitter-Cord-Cable-1-PC-Male-to-2-PC-Female-Socket-w-screw-lock-/330669359624

i think it would be much more elegant


-> edit ->
If you would then have a "simple" switch on 1 leg of the splitter ( that goes to the back) you could turn that swich on Off when doing your multiple exposure..
( that's by the way real easy for an electrician to do )

« Last Edit: June 02, 2013, 02:20:25 PM by julienlanoo » Logged
JoeKitchen
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« Reply #7 on: June 02, 2013, 02:21:35 PM »
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That would probably be a better solution.  Thanks. 
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Joe Kitchen
www.josephmkitchen.com

"Photography is one percent inspiration and ninety-nine percent moving furniture."  Arnold Newman
"Try not to be just better than your rivals and contemporaries, try to be better than yourself."  William Faulkner
julienlanoo
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« Reply #8 on: June 02, 2013, 02:29:34 PM »
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And cheaper,
Being 10 bucks for the cable and 1 beer for the electrician ( as i am not shure even you would need one thinking of it .. :p )
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Pics2
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« Reply #9 on: June 03, 2013, 06:36:18 AM »
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Joe, I don't still understand what exactly you want to achieve, but maybe this can help. Since I don't like connecting my strobe triggers ( I use chines ones, not Pocket Wizards) to the expensive Phase One back ( I remember that older Vivitar flashes burned down many Canons and Nikons, at least that's what I read on various forums), I do the following. I set exposure to 1sec or more or B and I fire my strobes manually. I work in complete darkness. I have a foot switch for turning off all the ambient studio lights, so it's not that annoying. You can make multiple exposures this way, i think. I also fire strobes near the end of the exposure, so there is another benefit of letting the camera stop shaking for additional sharpness. I do still life, though.
« Last Edit: June 03, 2013, 06:40:41 AM by Pics2 » Logged
Chris Barrett
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« Reply #10 on: June 03, 2013, 08:02:20 AM »
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I used to work this way with film (which was so much easier to do).

What I believe Joe is trying to do is shoot an interior at somewhere around 1/8 second and build enough strobe to expose the room correctly.  We used to overpower the ambient light with strobe by doing 4 to 8 "pops" at about 1/30th or 1/15th.  This would allow you to hold the view out the window while having enough light inside to balance the contrast ratio.

In the end, it always felt really artificial to me.  When you pump that much strobe into a room, the lighting just doesn't feel natural.  Also, practicals always read way too dark.  These days I only ever do one "pop" using strong enough strobe to augment but not overpower the ambient and then I blend the window in from bracketed exposures.  But then, I typically don't like to hold as much of the view as others.

Yada yada...
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JoeKitchen
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« Reply #11 on: June 03, 2013, 08:28:12 AM »
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That is pretty much what I am trying to do Chris, but not to the extent that the space looks artificially light.  I prefer to "fill in" the light with strobes when I am competing with the sun and usually let the outside go a little over to help preserve the natural lighting feel of the space.  

However, even working this way, the CF just eats up too much light for the fill to work in one shot, unless of course I bring 20K W/S worth of strobe power.  This is a little too much for me to want to carry into a job, not to mention too much money to invest and too much time in set up and ....

This is why I prefer the multiple exposure route when I am shooting with a CF.  When I am not using the CF, like on the Rodie 55mm, I do not use multiple exposures.  

I like working this way for some shots.  Sometimes I get the exposure close to where I want it at ISO 200, drop down to ISO 50, throw on the multi-shot device, and bracket with multiple exposures.  On a recent shoot, one final capture was the product of 7 multiple exposure, 4 with the strobes on and 3 with no strobes.  This preserved the natural feel of the space well, and I am finding that ISO 50 on the P45+ preserves the highlights much better than ISO 200 (and I can always drop them in place too  Wink )
« Last Edit: June 03, 2013, 08:41:06 AM by JoeKitchen » Logged

Joe Kitchen
www.josephmkitchen.com

"Photography is one percent inspiration and ninety-nine percent moving furniture."  Arnold Newman
"Try not to be just better than your rivals and contemporaries, try to be better than yourself."  William Faulkner
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