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Author Topic: Schneider-Kreuznach wa-digitar f2.8/28mm  (Read 1599 times)
johnpaulurizar
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« on: July 01, 2013, 07:41:12 AM »
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Hello,

This is my first post and love this forum for information.

I would like to know everyone's thoughts on the Schneider wa-digitar f2.8 28mm lens in copal 0 shutter. I am doing more location work with my Arca Swiss F metric 6x9 camera with rotaslide & binocular viewer and my current widest lens is Rodenstock Apo-Sironar Digital f4.5 f=55mm which is great for stitching due to image circle, but I would like to go wider. A friend of my let me use his Schneider wa-digitar 2.8 28mm wide angle lens and it works with my two digital MF backs (Phase One P25+ and Leaf Aptus 22) at f11 or F16, the real issue I had was the much smaller image circle. So, I am not sure about stitching images, compared to my Rodenstock 55mm. One thing I did noticed using this lens was the fact I could use it on a flat lens board with plenty room for my standard bellows.

So here is the question. Is it better to have a very wide lens like 28mm with small image circle or a slightly longer lens like the Rodenstock Apo-Sironar digital 35mm f4.5 with 105 mm image circle or Schneider f5.6 35mm XL?

I know other options like Rodenstock 32mm HR series lens is amazing but the price tag rules itself out. Also, I do not think my 22mp digital backs would see the difference. So price is a consideration.

Kind regards

John Paul Urizar
www.johnpaulurizar.com.au
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JoeKitchen
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« Reply #1 on: July 01, 2013, 09:19:56 AM »
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The SK 28mm f/2.8 is a discontinued lens and I believe was never a big hit to begin with.  I was even told by another photographer that some of Schneider's sales staff discouraged people from buying it.  Point being, the only way to find it would be to get an used version, which could be difficult.

The new 28mm I hear is very good and has a 90mm IC.  I have thought that maybe the lens would be a worth wild purchase, but with the CF, you would be looking at $7500.  

I mainly shoot interiors with a 35mm and find it to be more than enough to tell the story.  About 30% of the time, I really wish I had a 43mm as well.  Occasionally I find that I want a little bit more in the image, but I just can not justify spending $7500 for a lens that I only would use a few times a year.  I'd rather put that towards a back with a larger sensor a couple of years done the line, which would solve that problem (and others).  

I'd say you can not go wrong with the SK 35mm, just make sure you get the CF.  

Correction: $7500 price tag includes the cost of mount in the Arca R mount.  For you, it would be more like $6500 (assuming you went with a recessed board). 
« Last Edit: July 01, 2013, 09:41:35 AM by JoeKitchen » Logged

Joe Kitchen
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Steve Hendrix
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« Reply #2 on: July 01, 2013, 04:15:32 PM »
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The SK 28mm f/2.8 is a discontinued lens and I believe was never a big hit to begin with.  I was even told by another photographer that some of Schneider's sales staff discouraged people from buying it.  Point being, the only way to find it would be to get an used version, which could be difficult.

The new 28mm I hear is very good and has a 90mm IC.  I have thought that maybe the lens would be a worth wild purchase, but with the CF, you would be looking at $7500.  

I mainly shoot interiors with a 35mm and find it to be more than enough to tell the story.  About 30% of the time, I really wish I had a 43mm as well.  Occasionally I find that I want a little bit more in the image, but I just can not justify spending $7500 for a lens that I only would use a few times a year.  I'd rather put that towards a back with a larger sensor a couple of years done the line, which would solve that problem (and others).  

I'd say you can not go wrong with the SK 35mm, just make sure you get the CF.  

Correction: $7500 price tag includes the cost of mount in the Arca R mount.  For you, it would be more like $6500 (assuming you went with a recessed board). 


Closer to $5,600 - ish with CF and lens board (copal shutter).

The older 28mm as Joe mentions never caught on too well with digital due to the small image circle (60mm), although I do have a few clients that picked it up for use with older, smaller chipped backs as a low cost workable solution.

The difference between what John Paul is asking  - the 28mm and the 55mm, can come down to capturing with 1 shot what might take 2-3 shots with the 55mm. But also, even in 1 shot, you're pretty limited to what you can do with tilt or shift (rise/fall). A better "budget" solution might be the SK 35mm Digitar, with a 90mm circle, as long as you're not using a 60/80 megapixel digital back.


Steve Hendrix
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Steve Hendrix
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MFDB: Phase One/Leaf-Mamiya/Hasselblad/Leica/Sinar
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johnpaulurizar
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« Reply #3 on: July 02, 2013, 05:55:32 AM »
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Hi Steve & Joe,

Thank you for your thoughts.

It seems I will be in the market for Schneider 35mm XL lens. Is the rodenstock digital 35mm f4.5 not worth considering, it does have a larger image circle?

Kind regards

John Paul Urizar
www.johnpaulurizar.com.au
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Steve Hendrix
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« Reply #4 on: July 02, 2013, 07:49:44 AM »
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Hi Steve & Joe,

Thank you for your thoughts.

It seems I will be in the market for Schneider 35mm XL lens. Is the rodenstock digital 35mm f4.5 not worth considering, it does have a larger image circle?

Kind regards

John Paul Urizar
www.johnpaulurizar.com.au



True - the Rodenstock 35/4.5 does have a larger circle, but the SK 35 is a superior optic.


Steve Hendrix
Capture Integration
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MFDB: Phase One/Leaf-Mamiya/Hasselblad/Leica/Sinar
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JoeKitchen
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« Reply #5 on: July 02, 2013, 08:16:19 AM »
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In case you are wondering, here is example from the SK 35 shot with a P45+.  This image is a stitch of two horizontal captures, and slightly cropped in.  I believe the upper portion of the image is a shift of about 16 or 18mm (18mm is about the limit), and I did use a 1/2 degree of tilt to compensate for the sharpness fall off.  This image would have been impossible to do without the CF, btw.  Without the CF I would say you have about 6mm of good shift with bright edges in the image; with dark edges, I would not shoot without the CF, even with no shift.  

As you can see in the details, the sharpness is dead on in the center of the IC, but does fall off a bit towards the periphery.  I also lit this shot (especially the ceiling), keeping the need to push the image at a minimum, avoiding sharpness fall-off due to noise.  Hope this helps.  
« Last Edit: July 02, 2013, 08:25:35 AM by JoeKitchen » Logged

Joe Kitchen
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Lorenzo Pierucci
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« Reply #6 on: September 09, 2014, 11:24:35 AM »
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The SK 28mm f/2.8 is a discontinued lens and I believe was never a big hit to begin with.  I was even told by another photographer that some of Schneider's sales staff discouraged people from buying it.  Point being, the only way to find it would be to get an used version, which could be difficult.


Hi Joe,

i was looking for some info about this lens, most affordable wide i found so far in second hand market, and i bump in your post.
 
You think that will be a "bad" lens even on a 22 MP DB ? i recently got a 90mm rod digitar ( but not the red one ) and it perform great on the 22, while I'm sure will be so so in more powerful backs.

Your feedback will be of great value.

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JoeKitchen
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« Reply #7 on: September 09, 2014, 12:11:39 PM »
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Hi Joe,

i was looking for some info about this lens, most affordable wide i found so far in second hand market, and i bump in your post.
 
You think that will be a "bad" lens even on a 22 MP DB ? i recently got a 90mm rod digitar ( but not the red one ) and it perform great on the 22, while I'm sure will be so so in more powerful backs.

Your feedback will be of great value.



To be honest, I have no idea how it would work.  If you are worried about lens cast and cross talk on a 22mp back, I would not be worried.  Lens cast should not be an issue with your back.  (Although it recently has been shown the Dalsa sensors are overall worse with lens cast then Kodak?)

I do not know why people did not like this lens.  When I went into business 7 years ago, the lens was already being cycled out. 
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Joe Kitchen
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"Photography is one percent inspiration and ninety-nine percent moving furniture."  Arnold Newman
"Try not to be just better than your rivals and contemporaries, try to be better than yourself."  William Faulkner
Lorenzo Pierucci
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« Reply #8 on: September 09, 2014, 12:37:25 PM »
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Totally agree on lens cast: my Leaf sensor if not corrected with ICC, seem have a graduate magenta/green filter always on, when i shoot with the ROD 55 sironar...

god bless ICC
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