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Author Topic: New Panasonic GX7  (Read 17673 times)
Guillermo Luijk
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« Reply #20 on: August 04, 2013, 04:16:47 PM »
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and more often it is not actually, but an artificial argument of small sensor camera owners (who always insist that only their DOF is the right one for a shot)...

I own FF, APS and M4/3 cameras, and was just describing reality.
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Telecaster
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« Reply #21 on: August 04, 2013, 04:26:22 PM »
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NOOOOOOOOO........NOOOOOOTTTT the depth of field equivalence debate again. I gouge my eyes out!!! [sticking fingers in ears.] nananannanananananannanana. I can't year you people.  The GX7 looks like a lovely little camera doesn't it?

 Grin   Wink

Placed my order this morning. We shall see...and shall have much fun in the seeing!

-Dave-
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BJL
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« Reply #22 on: August 04, 2013, 07:49:04 PM »
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may be you need to take your regular medicine (whatever it is) first and reread my post
I read your post, and quoted these words of yours, underlining added this time:
"... small sensor camera owners (who always insist that only their DOF is the right one for a shot)... ".
Unless you have proof that owners of small sensor cameras "always" make this claim, you are talking nonsense.
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RFPhotography
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« Reply #23 on: August 06, 2013, 10:28:58 PM »
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thank you, but I prefer to avoid a shutter induced shock for a suspended sensor (@ certain shutter speeds), which IBIS simply can't handle as it is designed to counteract hands tremor...

You don't have to use the in-body stabilisation.  If an OIS lens is mounted, it takes precedence and the sensor becomes locked.
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RFPhotography
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« Reply #24 on: August 06, 2013, 10:30:34 PM »
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abomination... hopefully GH5 will not have any IBIS (as it is intended to be also a camera for videographers).


The in-body stabilisation in the GX7 isn't enabled for video capture.
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Vladimirovich
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« Reply #25 on: August 07, 2013, 12:11:12 PM »
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The in-body stabilisation in the GX7 isn't enabled for video capture.

I (others are fully entitled to their own, different, wishes) do not want to have the sensor which is not one solid mass with the camera and the mere fact that it is "disabled" does not mean that it is in fact fixed to a frame, we do not know how it is implemented and "disabled" might simply mean that IBIS is still keep it floating and just passively counteracting shifts of sensor from the "center" position instead of keep it floating with active shifts away from a "center" position to counteract hands tremor or other low freq movements of a camera's body...  and I am talking about stills, not video... I do prefer no IBIS for stills, as you might prefer a top level Gizro (or similar) carbon tripod (or a big wooden one) vs a $50 aluminum one for obvious reasons
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RFPhotography
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« Reply #26 on: August 07, 2013, 04:34:48 PM »
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According to what I've read, the sensor becomes locked in place and doesn't move.
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Vladimirovich
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« Reply #27 on: August 07, 2013, 05:18:20 PM »
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According to what I've read, the sensor becomes locked in place and doesn't move.
with all due respect you just read a word "locked", but not how exactly it is "locked" technically... a hint - get Olympus E-M5 (w/ that glorious 555-axis IBIS) switch it on w/ stabilization off and try to clean the dust from the sensor... you shall see how solid it is actually "locked"  Wink
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RFPhotography
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« Reply #28 on: August 07, 2013, 06:31:33 PM »
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with all due respect you just read a word "locked", but not how exactly it is "locked" technically... a hint - get Olympus E-M5 (w/ that glorious 555-axis IBIS) switch it on w/ stabilization off and try to clean the dust from the sensor... you shall see how solid it is actually "locked"  Wink

OK, you're going to piss and moan no matter what.  You, also, don't know what is being done in the camera.  You're making assumptions in order to justify your preconception.  Your mind is made up.  So be it.
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donbga
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« Reply #29 on: September 06, 2013, 10:57:25 PM »
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with all due respect you just read a word "locked", but not how exactly it is "locked" technically... a hint - get Olympus E-M5 (w/ that glorious 555-axis IBIS) switch it on w/ stabilization off and try to clean the dust from the sensor... you shall see how solid it is actually "locked"  Wink

I've looked at the output from the new GX7 in JPG format and the results were excellent (though I normally shoot RAW.) The camera handles and plays well in my palms. The new EVF is pretty impressive; having it integrated into the body puts the camera in a new class of Lumix rangefinder style cams. Video is excellent as you would expect from Panasonic (I'm not really interested in video either.) The camera is larger than the GX1 and G6 but not by much.

Since the camera hasn't officially been released in the wild how can anyone judge the stabilization features first hand? However the two Lumix Luminaries doing the public presentation acknowledged that in their opinion the IBIS of the GX7 isn't as robust as the OMD but is still very capable at any rate.

I'm predicting the GX7 is going to be a big hit.

Comments provided by a Lumix/Olympus fanboi.

Don Bryant


 
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scooby70
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« Reply #30 on: September 09, 2013, 09:54:50 AM »
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So, if the sensor isn't locked in place is it possible to manually clean the sensor?

If you can't I wouldn't ever consider buying a camera like this as sooner or later it'll need a clean.
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AFairley
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« Reply #31 on: September 09, 2013, 11:22:11 AM »
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I believe they all have sensor cleaning modes.
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scooby70
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« Reply #32 on: September 09, 2013, 03:57:45 PM »
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I believe they all have sensor cleaning modes.

They do and they're good and the sensors do seem to be very resistant to dust bunnies but I've certainly had to wet clean my G1's sensor when the cleaning cycle wouldn't budge the contamination and neither would a rocket blower.

I have been waiting for a small form body with IS but if manual cleaning isn't possible there's no way I'd buy one of these cameras. This is something I'm going to have to look into.
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stever
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« Reply #33 on: September 10, 2013, 10:26:54 PM »
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this is an issue that hasn't received all that much discussion
 - are the warnings overblown (as were the warnings from most digital camera manufacturers initially)?
 - are most users of these cameras not paying any attention to spots?
 - have production methods improved so much that production oil/film on the sensor is no longer a problem?
 - has ultrasonic sensor cleaning reached a new level

ultrasonic cleaning of my 5D3 is extremely effective, but it still occasionally requires manual cleaning even though the mirror is in front of the sensor during lens change.  I remain skeptical of any camera that does not have a user - cleanable sensor and would like to hear a lot more discussion from Olympus users before buying a camera with sensor stabilization - as attractive the prospect may be of sensor stabilization with fast primes.
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scooby70
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« Reply #34 on: September 11, 2013, 07:38:21 AM »
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My 5D requires manual wet cleaning quite often. My Panasonic G1 gets a lot more use and I change lenses a lot and yet it hardly ever suffers dust bunnies. I assume that this is for a number of reasons, I'm guessing here...

- Better "non stick" coating on the sensor?
- No oil lubricated moving mirror flapping about inside and shedding bits?
- Effective ultrasonic/whatever it is self clean system?
- A combination of all these things and nore.

In the several years I've had the G1 it's only needed a wet clean perhaps two or at the most three times but the key here is that it has required wet cleaning, I assume when something sticky has got into the camera and on to the sensor.

I'm not a fan of sending cameras away to be cleaned, I once sent a 20D to Canon and it came back in a worse state and then there's the cost and the time the camera is away.

I'd love a camera with IBIS but I think I need the reassurance from owners that it's possible to clean the sensor, even if it only needs it once a year.
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Guillermo Luijk
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« Reply #35 on: September 11, 2013, 12:07:28 PM »
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My 5D requires manual wet cleaning quite often. My Panasonic G1 gets a lot more use and I change lenses a lot and yet it hardly ever suffers dust bunnies. I assume that this is for a number of reasons, I'm guessing here...

- Better "non stick" coating on the sensor?
- No oil lubricated moving mirror flapping about inside and shedding bits?
- Effective ultrasonic/whatever it is self clean system?
- A combination of all these things and nore.

Add to your list: 5D sensor's surface 4 times G1. Statistically that means four times the chances of dust falling on the sensor.
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Telecaster
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« Reply #36 on: September 11, 2013, 12:18:35 PM »
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In six months of ownership I've cleaned my E-M5's sensor twice with Eclipse fluid. No problem doing so and no issues afterward. Both cleanings followed my loaning the camera to friends with no prior mirrorless ILC experience. They've since been educated re m43 sensor ettiquette.   Shocked

I've noticed that the camera's sensor vibration technique does a real good job of eventually getting rid of debris. Sometimes a dust mote doesn't come off immediately...but after a few vib cycles it usually lets go. And I realize as I'm typing this that over the past two months or so I haven't noticed any new dust spots at all.

-Dave-
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OldRoy
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« Reply #37 on: September 11, 2013, 12:42:51 PM »
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I have an E M5. About 6 months ago I noticed serious sensor pollution well within the warranty period. I investigated the options. Inevitably, asking for other people's experience on internet forums produced a blizzard of contradictory responses (what did I expect?) But at least one user online reported that he'd successfully wet cleaned the sensor himself, IBIS notwithstanding.

The Olympus dealers who supplied the camera offered to clean it for me as a chargeable service although they came up with at least 3 different sets of prices and turnarounds. Olympus indicated that it was a return to factory requirement and not dealer serviceable: I suggested they notify dealers of this fact. Jeeze!  I returned it to Olympus who sent it to their Portuguese centre.

It came back two weeks later, as promised. A few hours later I took it out and shot some casual snaps. The camera began behaving extremely unstably within a couple of dozen actuations - freezing up in a variety of different ways as well as various other weird manifestations. I tried a range of tests including using different lenses and warm-up periods as well as playing around with operating modes however I could detect no obvious correlations. I called Olympus and, of course, was asked to return it. Each courier visit eats up at least half a day.

When I got it back it began behaving oddly almost immediately although not quite as severely as previously. However I noticed that the sensor was covered in dead pixels which could even be seen via the EVF! I called Olympus and was asked to return it again. Cue impotent fury.

Eventually after clawing my way up Olympus' European food chain I managed to get the camera swapped (as I'd repeatedly requested) for a new replacement - after all I'd sent in a perfectly serviceable camera which they had broken and failed to rectify. To Olympus' credit they gave me an extended new warranty by way of compensation. Two months of headache. At least my D700 got some exercise.

Sometimes even taking the safe option doesn't necessarily work out as planned.

Roy
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budjames
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« Reply #38 on: September 14, 2013, 06:12:04 AM »
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The initial post shows an all black model. BH Photo and Adorama show a silver/black body only available for preorders.

Does any one know when the all black body will be available in the US?

Also, what is the highest quality zoom to get?

Thanks.

Bud
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Bud James
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« Reply #39 on: September 14, 2013, 07:17:55 AM »
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Currently available, the Panasonic 12-35 f2.8 and 35-100 f2.8. I believe that the Olympus 12-40 f2.8 will be out in November. All of these are a little on the larger side for m43, but extremely competent glass.
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