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Author Topic: Compositionally Challanged  (Read 16182 times)
Rob C
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« Reply #20 on: August 20, 2013, 08:36:37 AM »
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My method of "over-shooting" an image by taking numerous images with the intent of merging to crop/compose on my computer
because I can't seem to compose in my viewfinder...I've been told that it denotes a lack of composition skill and is wrong.  Is it so wrong?

There are no rules, just techniques: in my head, the more simple the latter the stronger the image. On the face of it, it seems a contradiction in terms to deny ability of in-camera composition but claim it via computer: they are just different ends of the same sausage.

Rob C
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Isaac
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« Reply #21 on: August 20, 2013, 11:48:39 AM »
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"Photography is not a sport... I believe there are no rules in photography. A photographer is allowed to do anything, anything, in order to improve his picture." Bill Brandt.
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wmchauncey
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« Reply #22 on: August 20, 2013, 12:07:55 PM »
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Photography is not a sport
I do like that response Isaac...       Wink
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Rob C
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« Reply #23 on: August 22, 2013, 02:45:35 AM »
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"Photography is not a sport... I believe there are no rules in photography. A photographer is allowed to do anything, anything, in order to improve his picture." Bill Brandt.


And in the age before Photoshop, he was probably right.

I very much wonder if he'd claim the same today. The line is no longer fine but almost non-existent.

Rob C
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Isaac
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« Reply #24 on: August 22, 2013, 09:53:34 AM »
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I don't know much about Bill Brandt's photography, but apparently he was willing to collage two negatives to make a picture of Top Withens -- don't like the sky, use a sky you like.
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Rob C
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« Reply #25 on: August 22, 2013, 10:48:01 AM »
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I don't know much about Bill Brandt's photography, but apparently he was willing to collage two negatives to make a picture of Top Withens -- don't like the sky, use a sky you like.


Then a questionable source to quote?

;-)

Rob C
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Isaac
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« Reply #26 on: August 22, 2013, 11:01:34 AM »
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Then a questionable source to quote?

If you have any actual knowledge that would suggest that quote was out of character, do share.
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fike
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« Reply #27 on: August 22, 2013, 01:53:41 PM »
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Photography is not a sport, eh???

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vfTR3QtbDbU

Kelby can make anything a sport.  As a photographer, I have much more respect for McNally than Kelby (Joe is actually a working photographer).  Kelby is a photoshop performer.  You can learn some great basics of PhotoShop from Kelby, but then you need to advance photographically from there.

There is nothing wrong with your approach.  Take it to the extreme to see where you can go with it.  As other have said, if YOU aren't happy with your results, then try some different things.  Make some games and rules for yourself (make it a sport, if you will).  Go out with your camera and a single fixed focal length lens.  Experiment.  Play. Get goofy.

The composited  image you showed is fine.  Sorry if you were going for great.  Combining 20 images didn't make the result amazing.  It still looks like a harshly-lit midday snapshot along a trail.  In a perverse way, this is a testament to your amazing Photoshop skills that the image holds together at all.  I think you have mastered photoshop, but not the basics of creating a fully dynamic exposure.  Don't invest more time in that shot.  go back and shoot some more until you are thrilled with the image components for your composite.
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Rob C
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« Reply #28 on: August 22, 2013, 04:15:26 PM »
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If you have any actual knowledge that would suggest that quote was out of character, do share.


You're attempting to dodge the bullet. Admirable sentiment, but in the context of the statement you made and my response, nothing changes. If you admittedly don't know much about the source, where the value in quoting it?

Rob C
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Slobodan Blagojevic
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« Reply #29 on: August 22, 2013, 04:23:42 PM »
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... where the value in quoting it?

You got to keep your quote generator busy, otherwise it becomes rusty pretty quickly Wink
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Isaac
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« Reply #30 on: August 22, 2013, 04:54:47 PM »
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You're attempting to dodge the bullet.

You're really really bored.

If you admittedly don't know much about the source, where the value in quoting it?

Even if I knew nothing about the source, the value would be that the quotation was apposite.
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Rob C
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« Reply #31 on: August 22, 2013, 04:57:22 PM »
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But Isaac, how could you possibly know?

Rob C
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wmchauncey
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« Reply #32 on: August 22, 2013, 05:12:17 PM »
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It still looks like a harshly-lit midday snapshot along a trail
Partially correct...6-22-08 @ 4:30 PM, back when I shot mostly in Auto Mode without a clue what was going on.      Huh
I keep working on it because of the natural "God Rays" and Muley twins in the same frame of the series.
Was taken from some property that went away with a divorce.    Cry
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« Reply #33 on: August 23, 2013, 06:59:36 AM »
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Kelby can make anything a sport.  As a photographer, I have much more respect for McNally than Kelby (Joe is actually a working photographer).  Kelby is a photoshop performer.  You can learn some great basics of PhotoShop from Kelby, but then you need to advance photographically from there.
Scott Kelby sometimes comes across like the world's luckiest amateur photographer. Why? Just see any post where he gets to stand next to the pro photographers at say an American Football match and he then gushes like a complete fanboi.
His business is teaching and writing, not taking photos for a living and he has an extremely successful business doing so.  But it would be foolish to carp at him as he's probably more successful than most professional photographers who make money by merely selling images.
McNally is obviously a press photographer first [and a very good one at that], but he's also a talented writer too. Although his book about how to use speed lights 'The Hot Shoe Diaries: Big Light from Small Flashes' should have been retitled 'The Hot Shoe Diaries: Big Light from Nikon Flashes and Nikon Cameras' as some of the 'advice' was quite specific to Nikon kit. Which is not a problem in itself, but not so good when stated as if it applied to all photography gear. Plus if I'm buying a book that is promoting a product i.e. in effect an advert, I expect to pay far less or get it for free. As that's the usual positive offset of putting up with annoying advertising.
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stamper
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« Reply #34 on: August 23, 2013, 08:42:14 AM »
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Quote jjj

But it would be foolish to carp at him as he's probably more successful than most professional photographers who make money by merely selling images.

unquote

Making money isn't the best criteria to judge how good someone is? Judging someone by what they produce is surely a better and more objective ideal. I have a couple of his books and swore not to buy any more, mainly because of his humour and there are better writers - imo - than him.The amount of money he has in the bank doesn't come in to it. Sad
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jjj
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« Reply #35 on: August 23, 2013, 09:18:18 AM »
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But it would be foolish to carp at him as he's probably more successful than most professional photographers who make money by merely selling images. jjj
Making money isn't the best criteria to judge how good someone is? Judging someone by what they produce is surely a better and more objective ideal. I have a couple of his books and swore not to buy any more, mainly because of his humour and there are better writers - imo - than him.The amount of money he has in the bank doesn't come in to it. Sad
But I wasn't comparing 'quality', just commenting on his success. He is more successful in his aspect of photography than many pro photographers who rely on just selling images to make money. And just because you are a professional photographer doesn't necessarily mean your photos are better 'quality' than an amateur photographer's. There are other important aspects to being a pro over simply being able to take good photos.

Besides 'quality' is probably too subjective a criteria to judge fairly in this case - you even use IMO to qualify your statement about Kelby's writing. Others like Kelby's writing for his humour, whereas you do not.
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amolitor
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« Reply #36 on: August 23, 2013, 10:10:34 AM »
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People who merge multiple photographs will generally nail down the white balance across all the images, as well as the exposure. This can be done in-camera if you're shooting JPEG or in post with the right tools. This might not produce *pleasing* colors, but should allow the stitching to succeed with cleanly merged colors. Then paint in local white balance adjustments as necessary to get pleasing color.

As for composition, well, having been digging around in this pretty seriously for a couple years now I find that photographers are insanely poorly served by their resources. Everywhere you look it's idiotic stuff like "Rule of Thirds" and "Horizontal Lines Convey Peace" and nothing about, you know, actual composition.

Henry Peach Robinson's "Pictorial Effect in Photography" (available free on books.google.com) is a nice relatively compact book on photographic composition. I was sufficiently frustrated with the state of the art to write one as well, which you can find by going to my blog and looking. I refuse to plug my own schwag in any but the most indirect fashion, and anyways Robinson said it all better.
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wmchauncey
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« Reply #37 on: August 23, 2013, 01:01:04 PM »
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Making money isn't the best criteria to judge how good someone is
I might submit that...if you sell your stuff, making money is the only way to keep score, do the masses buy your product.
A hobbyist, on the other hand, merely seeks adulations from his peers to stoke his ego.         Wink
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The things you do for yourself die with you, the things you do for others live forever.
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tnabbott
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« Reply #38 on: August 26, 2013, 06:37:19 PM »
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Sure...I use about 20 images to end up with this one


.

And with all due respect, this image holds no interest.   Why not take one low res shot of something compelling?
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Sharon Van Lieu
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« Reply #39 on: August 26, 2013, 07:44:16 PM »
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And with all due respect, this image holds no interest.   Why not take one low res shot of something compelling?

I wouldn't judge this image by how it looks on the web. Such a large image wouldn't compress well - it looks like it could be very beautiful seen larger.

Sharon
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