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Author Topic: C1 Pro and X-Rite Colorchecker  (Read 6048 times)
ErikKaffehr
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« Reply #20 on: October 17, 2013, 01:57:42 PM »
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Hi,

I would recommend using Adobe DNG Profile Editor instead of the Color Checker Passport software, mainly because with Adobe DNG PE you can tweak your profiles. In my view both CPP and Adobe DNG Profile Editor provide oversaturated profiles.

I have bought Capture One Pro, before I bought my P45+ back, so I am Phase One customer. I may have some bias for LR5, as I have been using LR since 2006 and I also have something like 65000 raw images in my LR5 catalog.

It may be a good idea for Phase One to add support for profiling with a CC card. You are not really profiling, that takes a monochromator, but just tuning real profiles to taste.

Best regards
Erik
Sorry, but I think it is turning a discussion that did not help me.
My English is not good and would just like to know if there is a simple way to solve my problem.
Recently I photographed some clothes and something very strange happened, because the color of clothing was a cyan but appear like green but the picture was totally different.
All other clothes and other colors were correct, only that it was happening cyan.
I bought the Color Checker Passport to calibrate my images and get the correct colors.
I can use LR / ACR, but I prefer Capture One.
If there is not an easy way I'll use the ACR when these situations arise.

If someone has the easy way to correct image color using ColorCheckerPassport, please post some video tutorials.
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Vladimirovich
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« Reply #21 on: October 17, 2013, 02:36:19 PM »
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Hi,

I would recommend using Adobe DNG Profile Editor instead of the Color Checker Passport software, mainly because with Adobe DNG PE you can tweak your profiles.
nothing prevents you from creating a base profile with XRite OEM software and then tweak it in Adobe PE (which has to use some base profile)... or use software from QPCard.
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Vladimirovich
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« Reply #22 on: October 17, 2013, 02:40:45 PM »
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Doug, I did with color editor, but the color not match perfectly, and there are some variations that need different edits.
I need a solution for solve this problem and guarantee the perfect colors, without hard manual work.
then shooting a consumer level target w/ few color patches probably will not help you... you need to build profiles w/ LUTs to do some tuning for specific colors and that really involves a lot of manual work and/or monochromator or custom made color targets with a lot of color patches and spectrophotometer...
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EsbenHR
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« Reply #23 on: October 18, 2013, 02:22:47 AM »
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Starting in the middle:
"our pipe" ? are you a P1 employee (like Eric Chan is Adobe's) ?

I'm sorry about that. I was certain that I filled in my profile here, but apparently that is not so.

Let me introduce myself then: I am a Phase One engineer in the Image Core group, which is responsible for image processing in Capture One and related products. I currently maintain the color management implementation.

Note the "implementation" part. We have a really critical guy ("The Image Professor") who needs to nod. Unlike me, he has a really good color vision for example.

I am also the one to blame for the current incarnation of the LCC-system, lens correction, most of the local adjustments, certain parts of camera calibration and many other things. I don't touch the GUI at all.


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what DNG has to do with all this (we are talking abour C1 and not ACR/LR) and how the pure matrix conversion is negatively affected by a curve(s) applied to demosaicked or not demosaicked data for before using that matrix to do a color transform from a scene referred data into some proper color space ? RPP does exactly that - roughly : wb, curves, etc before demosaick, then demosaick and then color transform as the last stage and pure matrix profiles do work properly... for as long as C1 does not do color transform from camera's "color space" into something else pure matrix profile shall work as intended regardless of whatever curves it applies internally before matrix from profile.

I am saying that your approach will only be useful for a very specific, and extraordinarily dumb, RAW converter.

It will not produce useful profiles for Capture One. I just used DNG-based converters to explain why your approach is useless in that case. However, DNG have a standardized conversion chain, so you could conceivably build profiles that specifically targets that case.

My point is that the ICC-profile is always linked to particular conversion process. I am not saying you cannot force Capture One to use such a profile; you can also force it to use a Trinitron profile (if you know how). I merely said it is useless to do so.

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that is not the subject of our discussion - the subject is very simple : whether it is necessary to use C1 to generate a tiff file from a target shot to build a simple matrix profile to be used in ICC or not

OK, so let me put it in simpler terms:
1) Yes, you can easily force Capture One to use a random camera profile.
2) No, it is useless unless the profile-builder have intimate knowledge about the RAW conversion chain.

Regards,

Esben H-R Myosotis
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EsbenHR
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« Reply #24 on: October 18, 2013, 02:29:02 AM »
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Sorry, but I think it is turning a discussion that did not help me.

Sorry; I did not intend to hijack the thread. I merely saw some bad advice and wanted to prevent you from spending a lot of time.

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My English is not good and would just like to know if there is a simple way to solve my problem.
Recently I photographed some clothes and something very strange happened, because the color of clothing was a cyan but appear like green but the picture was totally different.
All other clothes and other colors were correct, only that it was happening cyan.
I bought the Color Checker Passport to calibrate my images and get the correct colors.
I can use LR / ACR, but I prefer Capture One.
If there is not an easy way I'll use the ACR when these situations arise.

If someone has the easy way to correct image color using ColorCheckerPassport, please post some video tutorials.

Sorry, everything automated I know of, that would actually work, is a pain.

I agree with Doug that the color editor is the way to go in Capture One currently.

Kind regards,

Esben H-R Myosotis
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Vladimirovich
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« Reply #25 on: October 18, 2013, 10:10:16 AM »
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Let me introduce myself then: I am a Phase One engineer in the Image Core group, which is responsible for image processing in Capture One and related products. I currently maintain the color management implementation.
great, finally we have some technical person from P1 to torture here  Cheesy !!!

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Vladimirovich
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« Reply #26 on: October 18, 2013, 10:26:05 AM »
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It will not produce useful profiles for Capture One.

from which standpoint  Wink ? if camera is such that pure matrix based color transform is OK then it will be... if otherwise you need LUTs to fix certain colors then it is a different case

My point is that the ICC-profile is always linked to particular conversion process.

yes, it does and you can fit custom build ICC profile in your chain w/o using C1 to produce tiff file (because the data in that tiff file will be in original camera "color space" and possible application of any tone curves can't do anything bad for a pure matrix profile build w/o C1 involved)

I am not saying you cannot force Capture One to use such a profile;

great and more so, I can use it to get colors that I like... because tastes are personal  Wink, certainly when you need to adjust certain colors pure matrix profile is not enough.
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