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Author Topic: Adobe CC: any compelling features to make one WANT to upgrade to it?  (Read 15431 times)
Rhossydd
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« Reply #20 on: October 09, 2013, 11:06:03 AM »
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Saves seconds every time and that quickly becomes minutes and hours.
IF you use the pen tool.

I've never used it.
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Simon Garrett
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« Reply #21 on: October 09, 2013, 11:24:25 AM »
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Really? My free time whether I'm a professional or not is still my free time. If I can spend less time behind a computer and more time out shooting or watching the game on the tube...is that not worth something to you? Sometimes amateurs have even less time to spend on their hobby making savings in processing even more important.
Trading time saved against the cost of the means to save that time makes sense only if you can sell that time you have saved.  If it means you spend 10 minutes less using Photoshop and 10 minutes more earning at a rate of an additional $60 an hour then it's a good business decision. 

If you're not paid for your time, but you choose to value your free time at $60 an hour, fine - but you're still $10 a month worse off in cash terms. 

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smahn
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« Reply #22 on: October 09, 2013, 11:51:23 AM »
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It is a feature that I believe the pen tool in illustrator has had for a while. It occurs when working quickly with the pen tool that you place an anchor point a few pixels out. In the past you have have to go to the select point tool and move it into place or nudge it using the arrow keys. With the new behavior you simply hold down the space bar before dropping the point and you can move it into place. This works even if you have the anchor point by the handle.

Sounds like no big deal but as I said. Saves seconds every time and that quickly becomes minutes and hours.

I'm a big-time pen tool user, so I'd like to understand this, but I don't want to waste a CC trial yet as I don't plan on subscribing for quite some time (Like until they advance the whole pen pallet (path groups and colors, for instance) and make the paths more visible, to make me run to subscribe).

As things stand now as soon as you lay down a point it can be nudged with the arrow tools. Similarly, one can use the cmd/ctl key to turn the pen into the direct select tool on the fly, select a point and then nudge.

So I'm just not getting how introducing the spacebar into the mix is an advantage.  

And again, I'm not trying to challenge or debate you on this, just to wrap my head around it. How did you learn of this, is there a good tutorial on it you could point me to?
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Martin Kristiansen
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« Reply #23 on: October 09, 2013, 12:33:54 PM »
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My finger is constantly hovering over the space bar to quickly move the canvas anyway as I deep etch. Instead of having to use the command key to move the point you have just dropped you simply press the space bar before releasing the point. This allows you to reposition it. I usually notice the point is slightly out as I drag out the handles. While I have hold of the handle I press the space bar and can now move the anchor point, handles and all in one simple movement.

Hope that helps.
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eddy1234
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« Reply #24 on: October 09, 2013, 01:21:44 PM »
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I'm currently using Photoshop CS5, and to be honest, i could probably work with Adobe Photoshop 7, there isnt a MASSIVE need to upgrade every single time
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smahn
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« Reply #25 on: October 09, 2013, 01:52:11 PM »
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Thanks Martin, that helps. I'll just have to mess with it myself sometime.
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chez
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« Reply #26 on: October 09, 2013, 07:28:55 PM »
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Trading time saved against the cost of the means to save that time makes sense only if you can sell that time you have saved.  If it means you spend 10 minutes less using Photoshop and 10 minutes more earning at a rate of an additional $60 an hour then it's a good business decision. 

If you're not paid for your time, but you choose to value your free time at $60 an hour, fine - but you're still $10 a month worse off in cash terms. 



I think most people value their free time....I know I sure do. There are many things in life that we spend money on for just enjoyment...do you value spending money on things you enjoy as being worse off in cash terms. Is that how you look at things when you have a nice cold beer on your deck or that nice coffee in the morning. They just make you "worse off in cash terms"?
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ButchM
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« Reply #27 on: October 10, 2013, 02:47:27 AM »
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I think most people value their free time....I know I sure do. There are many things in life that we spend money on for just enjoyment...do you value spending money on things you enjoy as being worse off in cash terms. Is that how you look at things when you have a nice cold beer on your deck or that nice coffee in the morning. They just make you "worse off in cash terms"?

Well ... there are a few glaring issues with your comparison ... first, if there were only one source for coffee or beer and they manipulated their business model into only one option to purchase those items ... with the deck stacked in their favor, not the customer's interests ... how would that method fly? Even if it was affordable on the surface for the short term.

There is much more to consider here than the cost of entry. Even if we have an appreciation for Photoshop and desire to use it in the future, CC really isn't a modest commodity purchase you can accurately equate with buying coffee or beer ... there are many, many more options available to consumers than Starbucks and Anheuser-Busch ... they both must compete head-to-head with many other outlets that offer similar quality products ... for that reason alone, they could never force a 'til death do us part subscription model ... yet so many would have us believe that we should avail ourselves to such a model for Photoshop without question.

It would be nice if you could address the OP's question with specifics as to how features only available in Ps CC have enhanced your bottom line ... instead of the general platitudes of cost comparisons to disposable commodities. We are already well aware of the current price tag ... what would be helpful is if you shared, in detail, how you save time using CC ... That information would go much further in shaping our decisions rather than only equating CC with your beverage of choice ...
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Martin Kristiansen
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« Reply #28 on: October 10, 2013, 04:12:22 AM »
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We were, well some of us were, explaining what features we use in CC that save us money. Mine is the pen tool. Have a bunch of deep etching I am off to do today and will save another chunk of time.

What isn't useful is when someone like myself explains how I save time with a CC feature to have a bunch of people explain how I could do that in another program. Or to say so what there time isn't that valuable. Or to get into a debate about coffee.

Good grief.
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Simon Garrett
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« Reply #29 on: October 10, 2013, 06:49:30 AM »
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Is that how you look at things when you have a nice cold beer on your deck or that nice coffee in the morning. They just make you "worse off in cash terms"?

Of course not; I'll admit to enjoying both beer and coffee.  But having a beer or a coffee doesn't save me money. 

Similarly, spending $10 a month on Photoshop CC (or the UK equivalent in my case) doesn't save me money by providing me with better tools and thus saving me time.  But, like the beer and coffee, I've bought it anyway!

I'm just making the (obvious) point that for an amateur there's a whole different value equation in judging whether spending $10 a month on Photoshop CC is a good idea.  Time does not usually equate to money for an amateur user.  In fact it sometimes doesn't for businesses either: I've seen many silly arguments about how an investment could pay back in saved time, when that saved time isn't going to lead to more money-earning business.  Been there, done that, got the war wounds from people keen to waste company money on new toys. 
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chez
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« Reply #30 on: October 10, 2013, 07:01:30 AM »
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Well ... there are a few glaring issues with your comparison ... first, if there were only one source for coffee or beer and they manipulated their business model into only one option to purchase those items ... with the deck stacked in their favor, not the customer's interests ... how would that method fly? Even if it was affordable on the surface for the short term.

There is much more to consider here than the cost of entry. Even if we have an appreciation for Photoshop and desire to use it in the future, CC really isn't a modest commodity purchase you can accurately equate with buying coffee or beer ... there are many, many more options available to consumers than Starbucks and Anheuser-Busch ... they both must compete head-to-head with many other outlets that offer similar quality products ... for that reason alone, they could never force a 'til death do us part subscription model ... yet so many would have us believe that we should avail ourselves to such a model for Photoshop without question.

It would be nice if you could address the OP's question with specifics as to how features only available in Ps CC have enhanced your bottom line ... instead of the general platitudes of cost comparisons to disposable commodities. We are already well aware of the current price tag ... what would be helpful is if you shared, in detail, how you save time using CC ... That information would go much further in shaping our decisions rather than only equating CC with your beverage of choice ...

Butch...here you are again running off about  CC...you are missing out on the conversation at hand. Try clear your head out of CC for a moment, it seems to be eating you alive.

We are discussing what saving processing time means to people. I said if CC can save time in processing images, then it certainly worth the $10 per month...at least for me. others claim if you are not a professional charging out your time, then the time savings is not worth anything monetarily.

Why don't you join into this conversation rather than coming on complaining about CC once again. We've heard your complaints already...we understand CC is not for you...go have fun with your Gimp.
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ButchM
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« Reply #31 on: October 10, 2013, 07:48:10 AM »
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Butch...here you are again running off about  CC...you are missing out on the conversation at hand. Try clear your head out of CC for a moment, it seems to be eating you alive.

We are discussing what saving processing time means to people. I said if CC can save time in processing images, then it certainly worth the $10 per month...at least for me. others claim if you are not a professional charging out your time, then the time savings is not worth anything monetarily.

Why don't you join into this conversation rather than coming on complaining about CC once again. We've heard your complaints already...we understand CC is not for you...go have fun with your Gimp.

Still you are speaking in generalities of theory ... long on advice and short on the substance of actual real world examples.

It would be nice if you could provide examples (in detail) of how exactly the new features in Ps CC ARE saving you time and therefore money. That would answer definitively for those of us who speculate, that there is little to gain by signing up.

I am not arguing that your theory is invalid. I am simply asking you to offer specific examples for consideration that you have experienced to support your theory. It shouldn't be difficult to share and certainly would offer much more value to the process than than taking shots at Gimp ... which I don't use currently but I would not be ashamed to consider if it could serve my needs. I quit worrying about basing my personal status on what the "cool kids are doing" back in junior high school.
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Manoli
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« Reply #32 on: October 10, 2013, 07:51:20 AM »
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It would be nice if you could address the OP's question with specifics as to how features only available in Ps CC have enhanced your bottom line ... instead of the general platitudes..

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We are discussing what saving processing time means to people ... you are missing out on the conversation at hand.

Er, no we're not.
The title of the thread is ' Adobe CC any compelling features ...? '
Anything concrete to say, for once ?
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chez
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« Reply #33 on: October 10, 2013, 08:27:18 AM »
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Er, no we're not.
The title of the thread is ' Adobe CC any compelling features ...? '
Anything concrete to say, for once ?

I've been very busy with work, away on business for the last few months, but from my use of CC, I have found the smart sharpening enhancements really reduces the time I spend applying sharpening to my images before I print them. How much time is debatable, but this new sharpening is very smart and I have not seen any of the halos you can quickly generate using previous versions.

I've also looked into the conditional actions which can take on different actions given certain conditions being met. I use custom actions quite extesively and I think being able to have conditions within an action will allow me to build more complex actions, streamlining more of my processing.

The ability to put RAW processing as a filter on a layer is very interesting, especially if you want to tweak processing after you have done some other work on the image. I have not used this yet, but I can see the flexibility it offers being very powerful.

I am sure there are more features I will make use of...not to mention some streamlining of existing processing. Once I get more proficient with these features, I can see saving time in processing images. The smart sharpen has already shown to save me time.

I suggest rather than asking others what features are new in CC, just download a full trial version for yourself. Everyone approaches processing differently and what is important to me might not be to you...so YOU need to do the work and try it out yourself.
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chez
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« Reply #34 on: October 10, 2013, 08:30:26 AM »
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Still you are speaking in generalities of theory ... long on advice and short on the substance of actual real world examples.

It would be nice if you could provide examples (in detail) of how exactly the new features in Ps CC ARE saving you time and therefore money. That would answer definitively for those of us who speculate, that there is little to gain by signing up.

I am not arguing that your theory is invalid. I am simply asking you to offer specific examples for consideration that you have experienced to support your theory. It shouldn't be difficult to share and certainly would offer much more value to the process than than taking shots at Gimp ... which I don't use currently but I would not be ashamed to consider if it could serve my needs. I quit worrying about basing my personal status on what the "cool kids are doing" back in junior high school.

Butch, rather than sitting in your nice leather chair and "armchair quarterbacking", why don't you get out of that chair, download the trial version of CC and see for yourself what you are missing. Why do you expect others to waste time trying to convince you one way or another on CC?
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ButchM
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« Reply #35 on: October 10, 2013, 08:44:07 AM »
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Butch, rather than sitting in your nice leather chair and "armchair quarterbacking", why don't you get out of that chair, download the trial version of CC and see for yourself what you are missing. Why do you expect others to waste time trying to convince you one way or another on CC?

Well ... perhaps I expected someone so enamored with CC, and who is already using same, wouldn't mind sharing their experience. Folks do that on forums all the time. It is not unusual or without precedent to expect early adopters to share their experiences with those folks who are only considering venturing forth or questioning the need to take a deeper look at an offering. I'm surprised you find the concept so unappealing. When you believe in something, it shouldn't be difficult to offer depth of insight on the matter to support your findings.

Thank you though, for finally offering a substantive appraisal of your use of Ps CC thus far ...
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Philmar
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« Reply #36 on: October 10, 2013, 11:24:02 AM »
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And one of the less obvious benefits of CC will be the fact that the engineers can spend more time on the everyday 'ordinary' features as opposed to the fancy make people upgrade whizz bang features to help market a new version.

I hope you are right. My take on CC is different. I fear that once Adobe no longer needs new revenue in the form of a purchased upgrade that there would be less economic imperative to make upgrades. Subscribers are paying $10 a month to use the program and probably won't unsubscribe over a lack of program improvements. Subscribers have to continue to pay the monthly fee to use the program as is. With this guaranteed income stream i see less reason for the company to invest resources in to upgrades since the benefits would be lessened. In the past program upgrades were an economic imperative in order to sell upgrades, now CC will provide regular income stream.
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« Reply #37 on: October 10, 2013, 12:14:05 PM »
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Well ... perhaps I expected someone so enamored with CC, and who is already using same, wouldn't mind sharing their experience.
OK, I'll say that yes, there are a number of useful new features in CC (and a few coming soon I can't talk about) that make it a very worthwhile upgrade. For me. I'm not sure what you do in Photoshop. It's had a clone tool since version 1 and if you do a lot of cloning work, you might be fine running a 15 year old version although it's been refined in the UI department over the years. So for example, the new feature which allows us to use links, much like InDesign for working with Smart Objects is a very worthwhile feature for me based on how I build complex layered doc's. There's new functionality in the Pen tool. You may not use either SO's or the Pen tool so guess what, you'll think I'm nuts to spend the money on the upgrade. Which again begs the question why you don't download the demo and see for yourself if there are features that you find useful. What I find useful and what you find useful may be diametrically opposed.
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« Reply #38 on: October 10, 2013, 12:34:17 PM »
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I hope you are right. My take on CC is different. I fear that once Adobe no longer needs new revenue in the form of a purchased upgrade that there would be less economic imperative to make upgrades. Subscribers are paying $10 a month to use the program and probably won't unsubscribe over a lack of program improvements. Subscribers have to continue to pay the monthly fee to use the program as is. With this guaranteed income stream i see less reason for the company to invest resources in to upgrades since the benefits would be lessened. In the past program upgrades were an economic imperative in order to sell upgrades, now CC will provide regular income stream.


It is quite possible that at some point they might look at the PS/LR combo as a "cash cow". 

Hopefully they are smarter than that.  Every other instance like that has eventually resulted in business failure as some bright person takes advantage of the situation and comes up with a better widget.
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« Reply #39 on: October 10, 2013, 01:41:59 PM »
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I didn't take the time to read the entire thread so please forgive if this repetitive, but one PS CC feature I can no longer live without is using camera raw as a filter.  If you convert the layer to a smart object first it then becomes editable/non-destructive.  Being able to use local adjustments to dodge/burn are much faster and simpler than various layer techniques.

There are new features in ACR that can be useful such as visualize spots and the radial adjustment tool.

I also like the new larger dialog boxes for many of the functions, much more useful.

Regarding the use of Lightroom, it is far more than a DAM, and it's functionality incorporated into a work flow is a tremendous time saver.  Maybe you should give the 30 day trial of a Lightroom a real work out.

$10 a month for a subscription to use such powerful apps as well as have  20 GB of cloud based storage (like dropbox) is great value.
« Last Edit: October 10, 2013, 01:46:08 PM by Wayne Fox » Logged

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