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Author Topic: Purplish magneta on the eye lids and parts of the skin....  (Read 1542 times)
Phil Indeblanc
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« on: December 19, 2013, 12:51:27 AM »
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I'm noticing this on a couple of people I have photographed.   I don't always get it, but I am getting it twice in a row now.

Is this a lens correction issue, a camera issue, or something that's just part of the skin tone that needs to be there to show health???
If I color select and tone down, I get some of the other healthy saturation in reds and orange reduced also (Within LR).
Is this something I have to handle in Photoshop to do some precise selective color editing?

I think someone with some years of doing faces would know what I'm talking about. I'm using Canon 5dM2 files in LRv5.3. I hope this doesn't drift off to Canon colors and such...well not at least til I have my problem addressed :-)
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ErikKaffehr
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« Reply #1 on: December 19, 2013, 12:56:25 AM »
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Hi,

Can you post a sample?

Best regards
Erik


I'm noticing this on a couple of people I have photographed.   I don't always get it, but I am getting it twice in a row now.

Is this a lens correction issue, a camera issue, or something that's just part of the skin tone that needs to be there to show health???
If I color select and tone down, I get some of the other healthy saturation in reds and orange reduced also (Within LR).
Is this something I have to handle in Photoshop to do some precise selective color editing?

I think someone with some years of doing faces would know what I'm talking about. I'm using Canon 5dM2 files in LRv5.3. I hope this doesn't drift off to Canon colors and such...well not at least til I have my problem addressed :-)
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Phil Indeblanc
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« Reply #2 on: December 19, 2013, 01:07:38 AM »
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Hi Erik :-)

thanks,  I will see if I can shortly
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Phil Indeblanc
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« Reply #3 on: December 19, 2013, 01:12:59 AM »
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here  is a clip...
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Fine_Art
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« Reply #4 on: December 19, 2013, 01:47:52 AM »
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It should be more grey in those parts.
« Last Edit: December 19, 2013, 01:49:50 AM by Fine_Art » Logged
Redcrown
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« Reply #5 on: December 19, 2013, 02:05:40 AM »
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I don't think you have a lens or camera issue. The small sample you posted has a strong magenta color cast, probably the result of a bad white balance.

Use the WB eyedropper and click around in the "white" of the eye. See how the image changes and how the "purple" in the eyelids almost disappears. What little is left is most likely the natural color of the individual. It's not uncommon to find red/magenta tones in eyelids and eye sockets on some people.

Now, using the whites of eyes for setting white balance is usually a bad idea since most eyes are not true white. Yellow or blue cast in eye whites is most common. On your sample, using the eye white for white balance changes the skin color from a strong magenta cast to an equally strong yellow cast. So, just look at what K temp you get and back it off to taste.

If you want to further tone down the eyelids, use the LR adjustment brush with the temp/tint sliders.
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Phil Indeblanc
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« Reply #6 on: December 19, 2013, 03:09:08 AM »
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Thanks. The shot is in high key light , so all things are towards a bit colder WB to also make the skin anything but yellow. Well. I think the hours are getting to my head, so it looks like my WB was off. Although I wanted a whiter pinkish skin vs anything yellow...but that is whats causing it.
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Tim Lookingbill
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« Reply #7 on: December 19, 2013, 12:20:16 PM »
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There's more going on in that image that will prevent you clicking on a white target. I've never seen so much UV color crossover noise in a portrait shot as this one.

You're going to have to find the proper WB fishing around for it.

ACR's HSL panel shows dappled pools of Blue, Purple, Red and Magenta color pock marking various areas around the eyebrow, lower eyelid and eyelashes. Since there's this much UV iridescent contamination I just applied +10Amber Temp & -10 Green Tint, -20 Exposure and -15 Saturation in 16bit ProPhotoRGB to get the results shown below.

Those setting might work if you're editing the Raw file but if they don't keep in mind to override the color constancy effect from the UV the overall skin tone will have to have a Lab a*,b* combo where the b* is slightly dominant over a* like say a=9, b=12. If it still looks OK with a & b are equal that's technically caucasian skin tone according to the Color Checker chart.
« Last Edit: December 19, 2013, 12:26:27 PM by Tim Lookingbill » Logged
Phil Indeblanc
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« Reply #8 on: December 19, 2013, 01:03:06 PM »
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Thanks Tim,

What maybe causing my UV? I guess UV coated tubes would be a good start?
I think I have a couple heads that are older non UV. Others are a few years old.
If I go ahead and buy all new flash tubes I will see this gone? Really? 5 strobe setup for this!

I did the WB off a good exposed spot of white on clothing. I just dont want the yellow tone.

Here is another frame....
Also, when I do a "screen grab" the color profile is not included, so the saturation is down. This clip below is a direct crop of the raw(at zero settings), and the one on right is a crop in PShop using +25 so you can see the color more.

All new tunes? really? :-)
« Last Edit: December 19, 2013, 01:05:10 PM by Phil Indeblanc » Logged

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Phil Indeblanc
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« Reply #9 on: December 19, 2013, 01:18:16 PM »
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I guess I dont want a filter in front of my lens, but maybe thats what the prob is? really? :-)
« Last Edit: December 19, 2013, 01:20:41 PM by Phil Indeblanc » Logged

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MichaelEzra
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« Reply #10 on: December 19, 2013, 01:21:11 PM »
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Phil,
This kind of aberration is normally caused by not optimal optics, causing purple fringing in high contrast edges. You could try a different lens without any filters.
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Tim Lookingbill
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« Reply #11 on: December 19, 2013, 01:21:59 PM »
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Thanks Tim,

What maybe causing my UV? I guess UV coated tubes would be a good start?
I think I have a couple heads that are older non UV. Others are a few years old.
If I go ahead and buy all new flash tubes I will see this gone? Really? 5 strobe setup for this!

I did the WB off a good exposed spot of white on clothing. I just dont want the yellow tone.

Here is another frame....
Also, when I do a "screen grab" the color profile is not included, so the saturation is down. This clip below is a direct crop of the raw(at zero settings), and the one on right is a crop in PShop using +25 so you can see the color more.

All new tunes? really? :-)


I'm not understanding your comments about UV coated tubes and ( "tunes? really?" ), Phil. Are you trying to be funny? I'm not getting it. I'm just trying to help.

I thought your shots were taken with window light. I also don't understand your last posted sample with the Photoshop +25 sat. shot next to the screengrab. Your admitting you're not assigning your display profile to these screengrabs before converting to sRGB is just confusing me as to what you want us to do to help you.

Which "pinky" skin do you want and which of those shots shows it? You don't want purple and blue in the eyes? Reduce saturation in those channels in HSL panel. It worked when I did it on the first sample but found just adjusting WB and reducing saturation fixed most of it. You might try a combination of both approaches.
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Phil Indeblanc
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« Reply #12 on: December 19, 2013, 01:55:58 PM »
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Sorry Tim, tune=tube, a typo!
 
I don't photograph with any lens filters in the studio, so I automatically thought that my flash tubes may need replacing or I should gel the lights.  I was doing the smiley's :-) as I would hate to need to replace the tubes. So I was smiling and squirming.  I am actually about to reprocess and apply your recommendations. Then I can adjust to get the color I need. (more pinkish, non-yellow tone).
I should have mentioned the 5 strobes.( I guess not so easy to tell in the eye reflection).

I haven't posted how I like it to be. I was interested on how they got there, and if this is normal.

Thanks Michael...I'm using the Canon 70-200L v1, IS. I was up at F10/ISO100. (Although well cared for, they do get tossed around a bit, could that need recalibration?).
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Phil Indeblanc
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« Reply #13 on: December 19, 2013, 05:35:58 PM »
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I was also thinking, my walls are nutral, but I had a 4x8 blue screen out of the shot, and even somewhat covered but did get lots of light on it...That may have reflected in?

And if it is the lens, I wonder if it something that can get out of synch? or just the way it is.  If it is the lighting (Older Norm's and newer Photogenic's) in the mix.
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MichaelEzra
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« Reply #14 on: December 20, 2013, 08:29:45 AM »
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what about with another raw converter? Did you try RawTherapee?
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Phil Indeblanc
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« Reply #15 on: December 20, 2013, 11:18:02 AM »
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I just downloaded it a few days ago. I will give it a shot.

I will post a clip from RT, also a clip with Tim's method.
« Last Edit: December 20, 2013, 12:11:08 PM by Phil Indeblanc » Logged

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thierrylegros396
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« Reply #16 on: December 20, 2013, 01:10:47 PM »
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Could also be a camera calibration problem.

Have the same problem but in the deep shadows only !

Thierry
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Phil Indeblanc
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« Reply #17 on: December 20, 2013, 04:18:05 PM »
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Interesting.

Well I had thought I had at one time tried RT, but I mixed it with Photivio, which is almost unusable for me as I have little patients.
But I realized RT is actually pretty nice... Yet I lack the experience with it, and I doubt I will be able to develop it close to what I want any time soon.
I did notice some great color tools, and will take some time with this file in RT. 
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MichaelEzra
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« Reply #18 on: December 20, 2013, 11:26:50 PM »
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There are more (and further refined) color tools coming in the upcoming RT version;)
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LKaven
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« Reply #19 on: December 22, 2013, 08:16:52 AM »
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Phil, consider the role that your light modifiers might be playing in the process.  A lot of the fabrics used these days in scrims for softboxes and diffusers of all sorts are treated with bleaching agents that make them prone to fluoresce.  What you get out of these modifiers is anything but Kelvin-clean!  Beware especially of cheap modifiers that are manufactured with little quality control. 
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